Author's Note: From the introduction to "Open Salon" - This is what I read when I decided to join: Open Salon is a publishing platform with a built-in audience. It was developed for writers, photographers and artists of any stripe in need of a smart home ...
The operating concept here is "writers, photographers and artists of any stripe in need of a SMART home". Naturally I realize this is a most "sensitive" topic; those who perhaps fear commenting as it might reduce their chance of being chosen as "Editor's Pick" should of course absolutely feel free to remain silent. Also: Please know that what I offer for consideration, below, has nothing to do with my poems being read or not by O.S. members. The truth is, I do not actually even expect these little works to be noticed here except by a small, exquisite few (and that is plenty for me). The point of the post below is this: The lack of diversity reflected on the front page, i.e., the same writers being selected and featured again and again (the "in" crowd), as well as the inability for a newcomer to be noticed (I have suggested a daily feature on the front page whereby a newcomer's work is published and recognized) interferes with the process of true selection/choice; that is, there is less to choose from when a "Modern Megaconsumer" ('Popularity Metrics', as Kerry refers to it) approach is used by the editors in regard to what is shown on the O.S. Front Page. This is the issue I have at this time with the front page selections.
In short: The Editorial choices and selections DO matter. In my opinion, DIVERSITY matters as well. A tiny section on the O.S. front page devoted to Newcomers or even an imaginative post or even (gasp) a POEM or two on occassion could not possibly hurt the site, and might even help (i.e., more people joining and STAYING means a thriving community, and, from a sheer business perspective, more revenues).
OPEN CALL TO O.S. MEMBERS: In response to Beth Ingalls comment on Editor Kerry's post today on O.S. member complaints about "blog whoring" and "blog pimping" (complaints reportedly communicated to him via numerous emails), Kerry writes:
"As I've said before, we probably do occasionally fall into reading patterns and habits. But we try to surface the best content, and pay close attention to the Popularity Metrics [authors note: the tracking of O.S. Member ratings, views, comments on various posts] as another way to do that. Mass emails just isn't a useful tool for us, and from what I'm hearing, many members."
In regard to the Editors paying close attention to O.S. Popularity Metrics, I offer you the following concept, not original, of course, but perhaps helpful, just the same: THE TYRANNY OF MEDIOCRITY. Said differently: Does Kerry's comment to Beth imply that O.S. Editors' choice of what merits being included on the O.S. "Front Page" reflect our current society's obsession with catering to some sort of 'Model (informational/literary) Megaconsumer'?
I sincerely appreciate the opportunity Kerry has given us to dialogue meaningfully on this matter via his post today (that is, if indeed this is an actual "dialogue," although based on his more recent responses to members comments it seems it was really more of a "friendly reminder," aka O.S. bureaucratic 'dictate'). If this is indeed a dialogue, and not a 'dictate', I think Melissa brings up some wonderful points via her comment on this same posting by Kerry, and she offers meaningful suggestions that are worthy of further consideration.
To see said "dialogue," go here: http://open.salon.com/blog/kerry_lauerman/2009/06/19/a_note_on_blog_pimping
TIP:
Enter the amount, and click "Tip" to submit!
Rolling
metaness
James M. Emmerling
Chuck A. Stetson
Jimenace
Newton Fortuin
Salon.com
Comments
Kerry says,
"As I've said before, we probably do occasionally fall into reading patterns and habits. But we try to surface the best content, and pay close attention to the Popularity metrics (ratings, views, comments) as another way to do that. Mass emails just isn't a useful tool for us, and from what I'm hearing, many members."
I have found that ratings, views and comments are definitely not taken into account very often. I've seen EP's with 10 views,no comments and no ratings. So I don't think we have a problem with Mass consumerism at all. Quite the opposite.
My point about EP's is that they are made so quickly and so automatically (sometimes) it seems to just depend on the name. I will have to read all of this dialogue and get caught up but wanted to thank you for your post.
B
Newton: I do not have a "bad" side - Just speaking out according to my own "inner guidance" - high "teh" in action.
Beth: I have noticed this as well, but in general, the O.S. front page content does seem to cater to the mob, er, I mean masses (that was Newton that said 'mob'). I list several 'types' of posts that seem to be most popular amongst O.S. patrons over on Kerry's entry - Even if these do not make the front page, these sorts of posts get read by many.
I actually scoured the web for open forums that cultivate and encourage deep, thoughtful writing - figured that might be a better place for a literary misfit like me to go - but no luck. However, I am meeting some amazing people here on O.S. - some quality thinkers and writers who transcend mediocrity - and so I am content to remain for as long as the O.S. commumity can stomach me.
Thank you again for your inspiring comment on Kerry's post.
i don't usually complain about editor's picks, but when kerry announced that bill o contest i was really disappointed in how quickly he directed everyone to mortimer's video.
don't get me wrong... mortimer's video is hilarious! but i was watching the number of views and comments skyrocket, while no editors linked or commented on any of the other posts. mishima made two videos and didn't even get an ep. what's the deal?
that seemed really hasty and inconsiderate to me. i don't know how busy these people are and why they're not being more explicit about how they choose which content to promote. i only know that it looks really cliquish. was it really too much to expect an update with links to all the contenders? i found the response button on the cover page, but it's going to jon and kate crap today.
Thank you for commenting at Kerry's blog. I am discovering your poems, now.
I would like to see a little more variety on the cover. I'd like to see more political diversity. All the time I come across well-written and interesting posts, often by newcomers, that would be ideal for the cover -- and having a post on the cover would help a newcomer develop a readership.
Mishima, I have often thought it would be nice to feature a "newcomer's" post daily - one that warrants a closer view, which newcomers seldom get, unless they are resorting to inflammatory or histrionic material.
I remember when I was new (not so long ago), someone posted something along the lines of "I GET MORE VIEWS ON O.S. THAN YOU, SORRY MOTHERF*&%$er's!!!" (or something like that) - And indeed, this post was commented on by hundreds of people for several days - I could scarcely believe it! I thought of dropping out then, but am glad I didn't - There are some mighty fine people and writers posting on this here site.
Anway, regarding offering a Newcomer's Selection, I wonder if this has yet been considered by the Editors...Something to think about, I would think.
I wonder if I am next????
RATED
The front page is what people see when they click into OS for the first time. The over-arching intent is to create veiwership and readership. Hence the front page needs to be as broad as possible to attract the consumers that hopefully will, somday, somhow, make this site profitable enough to continue it's existence for all.
I have been at OS for the past 10 months because I love the content, the authors, and the plain old people who are free to post here to their heart's content. I make no claim to being a deeply intellectual writer, and in fact, I write very little. but I support the community continuously because I'd hate like hell to lose it.
There are tried and true ways to develop a readership here. Be involved, read and comment, add favorites, find your niche. But in all honesty, poetry is, and always has been, a difficult field for writers. I admit that personally, I don't read it here or anywhere. Poetry seldom makes the cover because, face it, poetry is not a mainstream activity. That doesn't make me less of a reader, of less intellectual prowess, or less of an OS community member.
100's have come and gone, many posts like this one have been written and commented on, yet life on OS goes on, thankfully, for now.
I mean to provoke thought, not offer blatant, unconstructive criticism. One small change (or more) along the lines of what Melissa suggests in her comment to Kerry, or perhaps a "Newcomer's Feature of the Day" so that diversity can be encouraged and also cultivated, could make all the difference in the world in regard to an open community not becoming a cultural, literay, and informational "clique". Cliques serve to restrict and limit, not expand. I value O.S. and all it offers, and I value the idea of 'expansion' - The community is growing, and growth requires adaptation, i.e., CHANGE.
I noticed an immediate but slight difference. Instead of being completely ignored, I am now communicating with people who do routinely come by and I have to assume that they have no problem with the notifications. My continual hope that others will come by feels pathetic to me. I don’t enjoy asking people to read my writing… but I’ve been doing it anyway. I try to only do it when I am really thrilled with my most recent effort… but I am always pleased with what I’ve done or I wouldn’t hit publish.
I have no idea what I will do next. Ideally I want to not care about the instant feedback and immediate gratification that comes from writing on the OS. Unfortunately I do.
Irritated Mother: That seems like a fine solution to the challenge of "favorites" postings dropping off onto 'page 2' of one's personal site (until if and when a different site-wide solution is found). Thank you so much for the suggestion (although I wonder if I will be able to figure out how to perform this RSS technical feat!)
I must admit that I am not familiar with your posts, but after I get done typing this comment, I intend to remedy that.
I have been posting here since October. At first, I got some EPs. Now---nothing. I don't spend a ton of time here---mostly because it depresses me. There are many excellent writers---but of these, only a few are consistently rewarded with props from the editors.
I have no idea what Kerry posted today. I stumbled upon your reply to it by accident. I probably will not bother to go see what he had to say, because I have come to the unshakable conclusion that the editors have their heads planted firmly up their asses---so, really, why bother with what they have to say????
Anyway, I post here because, like yesterday, when I did publish a piece, a few--, a very special, certain few--- came to read and comment---and that made my day.
So who gives a shit about what the editors have to say? They clearly care little about what the majority of us have to offer.
Good post.
If I cared more about OS, like I did when I first started here, I'd be jumping up and down and trying to get things changed. But now, I only care about the small readership I have. I have made some true friends here. I have been exposed to some wonderful talent. The rest---well all I can say is that if I wanted to wade in most of the shit that makes the cover, I'd be watching Jerry Springer and Entertainment Tonight instead of writing and corresponding with the talented and thoughtful folks here----many of whom seem to be unknown to the editors.
Please hang in, even though we don't always seem to appreciate it. It hurts me when I click into a "new-comer" and find 8-10 posts with no comments. On the other hand, it hurts me when great writers leave because the dissension becomes too much !
I read the comments over on Kerry's blog and saw 'METANESS' repeat dome of what I have been spouting for a bit. Kerry seems to think most of that will be remedied in a month or so. I Hope so. :) peece and strength!
peece,
dj
"I understand your frustration and anger. I've tried being realistic, but I'm embarrassed to see my posts high on the popular list, one real high, like top of the page can go no higher, and they are missing the coveted EP. Honestly I'm considering other outlets for my writing. I love the bloggers here, but why am I being ignored by those who make the decisions. Shit, EP's and Covers are important, ask seattlek8(congrats on her book deal I really mean this) but those of us who aspire to this level in our work are shut out by the arrogance. Editors, please tell me what offense I committed to earn your disdain. Please..."
If it were not for posters like him, I'd be long gone, but like him, I, too, am looking for other avenues for my work----because, let me say it again, it seems that the editors can't see much of what is going on here, because they have their heads stuffed away, I need not repeat where.
If you want to ANOTHER BLOGGER'S post write a COMMENT to PopSmiley's blog. This is a "grassroots best picks" blog, there are no articles here written by PopSmiley.
PopSmiley does NOT override your pick: whatever you present in your comment will be included in the list. Show the link and a one-liner stating what is good in the post.
When I started posting here, I received several EPs, so I 'm guessing the complete lack of recognition isn't because my writing sucks. Or, maybe it does---I don't know, and really, I'm at a point where I have been ignored so completely by the editors, that I think maybe it is true.
Anyway, I don't blog-whore, never have. I use the delete key frequently when I get inundated with other posters' notifications. And I may or may not continue posting here.
I don't know for sure where the editors have their heads----I just know my work is apparently of no interest to them.
m.a.h. - This is why my heart is aching - that writers such as yourself might even allow the "tyranny of mediocrity" to cause you a moments doubt regarding your actual ability.
Rodin, the great sculptor (French) write about the tyranny of mediocrity often - When Editors put out an Open Call regarding the Jon and Kate show (as Kerry did yesterday, garnering over 800 responses last time I looked, thus explaining why this was the great and worthy topic of discussion for the day yesterday), I really have to say something, regardless.
Newton, thank you for ever r/Returning.
PopSmiley - Thank you - I will check this out!
Arthur: What size shoe do you wear?!?
Seriously, though, as far as EPs are concerned, our posts are so unconventionally outside the mold, we have no expectations of ever achieving cover status. We’re quite grateful for the small but eloquent following our work has inspired. The rich relationships we have developed with fellow creatives over the course of just a few weeks is really quite astonishing. This is an amazing community, and I hope our experiences will continue to inspire, rather than discourage.
I’m glad to know about PopSmiley, though, and have added it to our favorites. Always nice to have a grassroots alternative to the mainstream system. Maybe this will help us each find the true members of our creative karass.
Thanks again, Angelique, and I’m looking forward to reading more of your work as well as the other unsung posters who’ve shared their feelings and insights on this provocative topic.
—Melissa
It's all a looking glass. Look in & pick & choose what you need, what comforts you (your guilty pleasures),what enrages you, what gets you "feisty"...etc...it's all YOU, Angie, you know that. It's here for you. For all the "you"'s. For the endless I's...eyes...
Mediocrity is ok with me if it's heartfelt. We all know what's going on here. People are screaming for recognition. Recognition is what sustains us, makes us more human. Look at it like this (here comes my elitist side): How would you know how good you are if there wasn't dross to compare yrself to? Endless mirros, as you've mentioned repeatedly...
The challenge is to absorb the mediocrity & know it for what it is. It's human. Humans evolve, though. Alot of the best writers started out writing fluff. I could name a few.
It's hard to be brilliant. But it's a responsibility. These mediocre people are looking to people like you to come off yr poetic high horse & mix with em. "When you go out to heal the sick/ you must first forgive them,,"
You have a concise, electric way of stating what needs to be done, now! That's a precious gift. Jump in the mud & use it...ha
Jim
—Melissa
Dont know if you know my pal Slavoj Zizek. He's a trip. Crazyass East European Lacanian/Hegelian. He says this is basicall how religions get started. CULTS! They are formed of the outcasts. He says Christianity started with the miserable wretches, who would be the equivalent of the homeless, drug addicts, mental cases, etc of today. Alot of...um, I am tempted to say "us", but of course I am not one. Yet I am. It's an interesting dance for me, pretending to me crazy & unemployable, but, hey, fuck, it works. Anything to meet survival needs,. right? I just need a space,
a space, like here, OS...a space to unload my head & get some damn Communion.
"Jokerman dance to the nightingale's tune/bird fly high by the light of the moon"
The doves, those white doves, um, blowin in the wind....you know?
sailin the seas...lookin for some sand to sleep in..the sand box
that's where we all gotta get back to....remember that? The sheer childish creativity of the games & plans & laws we created as children?
. . .
The problem, of course, is being an adult. All we OSers intimidated by this one's degrees, that one's publications....what is this, we wonder? A competition, or...
a communion? Both. The ones who understand the nature of the medium will perservere..
\or they'll give up...
and go to something else...searching for that of which we are, as you said,
devoid...and what is it? It is the timid realization that , though we are all separate, we are ONE. My "I" is your"I". We have adventures, our I's, and we think and feel and play and work as separate beings, but in the end, it is all material to be shared...with those of our own kind....we I's...
Good controversy. I suck at controversy. I just want everyone to get along & never understand why we can't. I'm naive & I don't like to fight. I got no feistyness.
ach. Jim
It is this idea that I am attending to in this thread. I think I already know the answer, and it all makes sense, given that, in the end, revenue-stream is an essential consideration by sites like O.S., and therefore, "mass" appeal is cultivated.
I have been toying around with an idea that I one day plan to share via private PMs to select individuals - an idea that I imagine would hold great appeal to multiple advertisers and book publishing companies. Stay tuned...(Did I tell you I used to work in Marketing at the 'Executive' level?)
No, I think you forgot to mention you were an executive marketer. Along with being a counselor of some sort, and having some kind of teaching gig.
Realize: this makes you pretty intimidating. But that's good.
I suppose we need a grand metaphorical image for OS. We need to "personalize" it, kind of....give it a body...what could we symbolze the much vaunted "revenue stream" as? Blood? Or food?
The consumption angle. Eat. There is nothing more savage or primal or ruthless as the chewing & digesting of food...
That's why i'm semi-anorexic i guess. ...the food of the revenue stream...the "good" food vs. the junk food...nutrition...what then would the quality stuff be?
sorry if my"knitting" of yr thread is not what yre looking for...i can tell yre in a bizness mode & i'm floating in the metaphorical realm....
this idea of yrs sounds quite subversive....like a yummy chocolate granola bar..
Since by now you hopefully have obtained "The Confederacy of Dunces," you will eventually read of the uprising Ignatius inspires at his Factory job...(tee hee) - It is one of the most magnificent parts of the book.
I happily accept the 'trans-fat' nature of sites like O.S. (in regard to front page selections) and, as a result, I have been searching for sites that value more nutritious fare for writers, with not much luck. When I say "more nutritious fare" I refer to writing that dares to penetrate the surface of things - you know what I mean by that. If I see one more Editorial-Pick "Please help me" post (see front page today) I think I may succumb to...I don't know what.
For sure I have pissed off more than a few people with my snarly comment on Kerry's post Friday - I even dare to mention one person by name...I am a doomed woman.
"Frankly, My Dear," I don't give a hoot. When I (and others like me, both newcomers and 'old-timers' alike) am not encouraged by the 'powers-that-be' at O.S. to feel actively invested, I do not feel invested, as a result, with all the attendant consequences. That I care enough to bother putting a post with a few suggestions of my own out belies the fact that, as you would say, "I am a girl, after all..." (continuing to care when the caring is likely pointless).
According to 'KindofBlue', Kerry has stated that O.S. is NOT a community; therefore, it is inferred that our suggestions in regard to how newcomers are encouraged (or not) to 'invest' in the site are a moot point. Saying O.S. is not a community is, to me, a blatant denial of reality - That's what people tend to do, by the way, when they do not want to make the effort to change -DENY REALITY (refer to "Generous Consumption" for more on that; also, for more on the primal nature of "chewing and digesting," and the urge to bite my father's stump fingers off.)
And yes, I have many identities. I am all of them, and none of them, simultaneously, never confusing my Self with various identities, both cultivated intentionally by me, and those others imbue me with and/or project onto me. It is a masquerade, and there are many masks at this dance to be donned, and then discarded...
They dont exist, as you know but can't feel... this IS a community, she's IN it, for Christ's sake...she said that at a point in her timespace when she was feeling preyed upon, perhaps.....forgiveness, woman! Good God....as you say, it is a masquerade, everyone knows it subconsciously, WE know it consciously so...
It's time, maybe?, to stop snarling & groove. When hopefull y the anger of one of yr persona-masks being hurt subsides, and you realize...um...where you ARE, now , here on OS....that you (and our comrades) have carved out a piece of this place for ourselves, have USED it for our own purposes....you won't scare us all by these hints & innuendos (so commmon..see Mr. mustard) that you're going to fly off....to better skies....
the sky is blue...
leave the snarling for the dogs & wildcats of war f or awhile..
Jim,Fellow snarler who has given it up (at least in the "physical", "social" world) for his health...
(before you heal the sick you must first forgive them)
If anyone finds a place for writers to actually have their work critiqued/acknowledged, maybe even sold, please let me know, and I will do the same.
The BS on the cover here is getting more discouraging every day.
Jim - This is the "girl" versus "boy" brain biology thing again. I am not willing / able to take an "I got mine" stance; I am looking at 'the system' and thinking of others, including 'the newcomer.' However, one post is enough on that count, and I am at rest and at ease - Even when I am 'snarling', believe it or not. "Anger passes through the sage as naturally as clouds moving through the sky." I embrace ALL of it and have fun with ALL of it...I had a lot of fun on Friday whilst laughingly snarling...rather like a big mama Bear, thinking of the O.S. young, and feeling protective.
Naturally, many commenters thought it was solely about 'me me me' no-one is reading my posts, boo-hoo...An understandable reaction/underestimation/default - which is why I added the "authors note".
WHEEEEEEEE!!!!!!
My precise feelings, precisely!
I have been cooking up an idea, and you will now be on my list to receive a PM about it, once I have fully envisioned it. It is an idea that I think will offer what I am seeking, and that I think would be supported by advertisers and book publishers. I am making a note of who to send a PM out to later about this (as in later this summer - I have much going on at present); I hope I may include you on this list of recipients once my idea is more "full."
Just discovered you and I very much enjoy reading and writing poetry. Right, that poerty is not a popular medium here, but it's still a very good place to share with those who embrace it's simple creativity. I just write it when the mood strikes and it is more for me than for the OS community that rather prefers posts on newsworthy subjects, politics, world struggles, the breakdown of the party system and popular reality TV. I enjoy reading that to a point, however, it sure is refreshing to read a great piece of fiction, some haikus and life experience of others. Hey, I'll gladly check out your poetry and now that I know who you are, will be alerted when you put a new one up. PS - I do believe that sending new post PM's to select favorites is perfectly OK and also appreciated by those who enjoy your writing style. More that not, the ones who prefer not to be notified will let you know. In 10 months, only 2 members asked not to be sent PM's of my new posts. I respectfully removed them from my notification list. No prob. I do understand that there is so much going on here on the OS and some choose tactics that can be distracting at times, however, that goes with the "open" territory. Like everything else in life, this site is about "choice." I am content to know that I have options here and can write to a very few, sometimes a broader audience or just for myself. It's been a real kick for me, a creative outlet for what's in my head and quite theraputic soe days/nights. My motto: "Keep on keepin' on."
Regarding your well thought out comment: I would add one caveat to what you say: You mention that for you, as a reader and O.S. site participant, it's about "choice." In response, I would say that this is precisely my point: The lack of diversity reflected on the front page, and the same writers being selected again and again (the "in" crowd), as well as the inability for a newcomer to be noticed (I have suggested a daily feature on the front page whereby a newcomer's work is published and recognized) interferes with the process of true choice; that is, there is less to choose from when a "Modern Megaconsumer" ('Popularity Metrics', as Kerry refers to it) approach is used. This is the issue I have at this time with the front page selections.
Suznmaree: You reflect my thoughts wonderfully well, and much more simply and elegantly, I might add. Thank you for adding to this dialogue!
We would be honored if you included us, as well!
Thank you again for hosting this rich discussion, and for getting us thinking about alternative ways to share our work with kindred souls.
—Melissa
I wear size 13- clown size, extra wide. and your soft slipper?
and under the 'eratta' daily rambling, noting I am clownish.
extremely familiar with a mystery of 'enmity' and bare feet.
I'll go for a pizza pie run. To tip or not to tip? You be merry.
I’m so glad I came back here. I was racking my brain to figure out where I saw the remark about Confederacy. As mentioned in my comment on Jim’s recent post, I was really hoping it was Jim who was about to read that, because he MUST. And I’m really glad to see my hunch that you were the one talking about it was true. All this OS’ing is starting to blend together. Just one enormous vat of words, some more beautiful than others, but those of kindreds like yours always seem to rise to the surface.
And thanks for the congrats. The piece didn’t actually make the front page (or if it did, we didn’t realize it ;-) A little sticker just mysteriously appeared on our homework. Maybe it wasn’t a fairy, after all. Not so sure about Santa Claus, either. Possibly the EP Bunny?
—Melissa
Hmmm...if you did not make the front page, what did you 'make' (what was 'the sticker'?)
Liked this though because I can picture you vividly as this cloud passed through:
"'Anger passes through the sage as naturally as clouds moving through the sky.' I embrace ALL of it and have fun with ALL of it...I had a lot of fun on Friday whilst laughingly snarling...rather like a big mama Bear, thinking of the O.S. young, and feeling protective".
I don’t know, it’s still all so mysterious to me. All I know is that shortly after we posted our piece on Sunday, we happened to refresh our browser. Upon refreshing, our eyes alighted on the words “Editor’s Pick” in the upper righthand corner, set in small caps, sans serif (hmm, what is that font, I wonder, Verdana? . . . oh yeah, sorry, I get distracted by typographical musings). We thought maybe that meant it would appear on the cover, but we looked the next day and didn’t see anything. Same thing the following day. From this empirical evidence, we extrapolated that EP does not always a front page make. Apparently, sometimes “Editor’s Pick” just means “Editor’s Pick”. If that makes sense.
Postscript: It is Verdana! Verdana Bold! I just pasted it into VoodooPad and confirmed.
—Melissa
as forall this model mega consumer stuff, i am happy to report i met the m..f..ker last time i picked up my scips at Walmart. he was in the heavy equipment aisle. he chose a large leaf blower to purchase.
i ambled up & got his confidence by playfully acknowleging his little bratty snotnosed hyperactive kid. he asked me my o-pinion on the brand of blower. i told him i had alot of luck withit,
blowing all the stars that fell on my yard last night into the fucking neighbor's yard. i hate that neighbor, always on me to recycle, recycle, etc. let him recycle those things...make stardust sprinkles in a squirtgun to
bestow grace on yr good samaritans,
if there are any left. ach
So Joni Mitchell was right (refer to 'Woodstock'. And yes, she wrote this song, not CSNY, although I believe she was hooking up with Nash at the time, after previously hooking up with Crosby - and that hook-up inspired 'The Dawntreader' off her first album).
woodstock was absolutely definitive ly written by joni. i would hope that in this enlightened world nobody wouldnt know that...however...
i didnt know that bit of gossip..thank you...i personally love gossip about love lives, tho i pretend not to/ha
That's some good gossip, isn't it?
corner of the universe where such magical things happened...what else ya got on Crosby?
say...there's some awful rumor that michael jackson....you remember him, dont you?...was found KAPUT. hm.
if it's true, i guess farrah's hair blew away down the timestream....
oh yes i see tis true...cnn, the most trusted source of news is on & everyone is wearing some silly sorrowful mask.
any details on the condition of the body? did he do a david carradine?
i/I, to go all simonetta with that "/"