I deliberated long and hard about this post. Would I sound racist? Intolerant? Can I even use the term “illegal immigrants”? Then I began to internally rail against a stifling political climate, where it’s difficult to utter one word about racial issues or immigrancy for fear of cold shoulder repercussions and self-righteous indignation.
And this isn’t an unfounded fear. Whenever I spoke to someone about my Mexican neighbors and their legality, people shut down almost immediately. This included public officials and the owner of the house.
But let me back up. Three years ago, a family of Mexican descent moved into the 2-bedroom/1-bath house next door. They were not on the lease. As is often the case here at the Jersey shore, a business owner signed the lease, so one (or many) of his or her employees could live here and still work in that business.
When my brother first told me, I was surprised at my initial thoughts. Would they pack the house with people? Would it be noisy? I knew I was stereotyping…but unfortunately my concerns quickly came to fruition.
The first week, dozens of people came and went, lining the driveway and street with cars. The new renters parked a car on the front lawn that hasn’t budged since. It became noisy. This wasn’t a party-loving family per se, but there were a lot of adults and children in and out.
After a few weeks, the guests died down. But as I’ve come to realize, one problem quickly replaces another. Soon noisy cars were idling outside of my bedroom window as early as 5 am. People moved in during the middle of the night (into the front porch, which the census began calling “Apartment B”!). Cars beeped aggressively throughout the day.
When I asked the woman of the house if she could tell her children to play in their backyard and not next to my window (I work from my home, right next to their driveway, where they congregate), I was treated to one of many mean looks.
I could relay more “horror stories”: The loud music, the men who checked me out when I left the house in the morning, the daycare “business” they tried to pull off. But after about a year, I put the kibosh on most of it. I called the realtor and the owner of the house. I called the police. I even wrote the mayor about the problem of third party leasing, where people live in a house for years and aren’t required to have their names on the lease. I was successful, for the most part. The car horns stopped, the strangers living there for short periods of time, the car idling, the music playing…all stopped.
I wish I could say it’s fine now. It’s not. The tension continues. Because, for me, the bigger issue is their possible illegality in this country.
And this is when everyone fidgets and grumbles. People will often ask, “How do you know they’re illegal?” To which I respond, “How do you know I’m legal?” Fortunately or not, you generally don’t have the right to ask someone about citizenship status. But telltale signs arise: the lack of a driver’s license, under-the-table jobs, questionable license plates on permanently parked cars, moving in the middle of the night, house-stuffing…all signs.
The husband works at a restaurant here. I’m guessing he has some sort of extended work visa. The wife, I’ve surmised, does not. Their children are matriculated into the school system and are picked up in front of their house on a daily basis by a school bus.
The political climate tends to be polarized on this issue. Republicans want stricter reform when it comes to citizenship and deportation. Democrats want more integration and allowance. For the first time in my life, I stand warily by the side of the Republicans.
Many people will say, “But they are good people. I have an illegal clean my house and she’s a real sweetheart.” Or “Nobody wants those low-paying jobs anyway. We benefit from it because we pay 10 cents less for lettuce.” I’ve heard it all. Generally I’ve never heard these statements from someone who lives next door to a family of questionable legal status. Because niceness and a strong work ethic have nothing to do with it.
It’s not that different from living next door to a drug dealer. Covert activity, disruptive behavior, a bucking of local laws and ordinances for their own personal gain, a sense of entitlement.
Yes, a sense of entitlement. And perhaps that’s the most aggravating aspect. My neighbors actively dislike me because I had the audacity to enforce my rights and make them conform to local laws. These changes weren’t made to be neighborly or considerate of me; they were forced to make these changes.
I try to imagine what it would be like if I moved to another country with the goal of staying there permanently and integrating the entirety of my family there. I’d know I was doing something illegal and I would live my life in fear. I’d stay under the radar and adhere to local protocol at all costs. I’d learn the language as soon as possible. Actually, it’s hard for me to imagine it; I wouldn’t do it. But people are doing it, by the millions. A certain shoulder shrugging goes on that I wish applied to me when I broke a law.
One woman said to me, “Well I guess you don’t know what it’s like to go hungry.” No one should ever assume because I’m an American that I’ve never gone hungry. But more than that, her statement highlights a genuine lack of knowledge about this topic.
When it comes to Mexico specifically, most aren’t crawling to the border, starving and homeless, desperate for a good meal. They are moving here because they make more money here. And they can send it back home by the billions to their relatives, where that money is worth more. There are tax loopholes that they can take advantage of, a system to exploit. They move here by strategy and choice, not out of desperation.
Of course, this problem is multi-layered in its complicity. The hiring businesses, the realtors, the owner of the house who lives several states away and mindlessly deposits a check every month, the IRS, consumers, the politicians who enact laws to protect the hiring businesses–and, of course, the families themselves–are all responsible.
During an economy that most certainly affects me, it’s hard not to wonder about the repercussions of millions of people living here illegally and the impact they have. It seems to be more of a land of opportunity for them, not me. Not just these neighbors but the entire (growing) community of newcomers here seem to be doing pretty darn well: nice cars, latest iPhones and gadgets, new clothes.They appear to be the middle class I once was. Still, some will argue that they have very little impact or actually contribute to the economy. I can’t imagine that to be entirely true.
Regardless, it doesn’t justify millions of people living here illegally simply because they contribute to the economy. (Didn’t the drug dealer?) Whether it’s the Mexican family next door or the Pope or a Lilliputian, if you’re here illegally, you’re committing a crime. That’s not to be downplayed for the sake of cheaper lettuce or a spotless home.
So I continue to receive the dirty looks from the family next door. And their friends. (Their community outnumbers mine at this point.) My belief system includes the importance of “loving your neighbor” and I'm not even close, unfortunately.
And yes, I know. Bad neighbors are bad neighbors, regardless of their origin. But to deny the illegality aspect is missing a critical piece of the problem. And if they are legal, then I’d like to believe that newcomers would be more than willing to adapt to the ways of the host country.
After one episode a while back, where many people were visiting and kids screaming and running in and out of the house into the evening, I asked them, again, to keep it down. (Now I no longer ask; I simply call the cops.) The man of the house, a nice man for whatever that's worth, responded to me: “But this is my way. This is my way.”
And I said, “Yes and that very attitude is the problem.”
He didn't understand me.



Salon.com
Comments
LammChops, thanks...I needed that.
And we now live in a country where we have many Americans in jail for smoking marijuana while illegal aliens who have broken the law to come illegally to our country are receiving benefits and amnesty. It's an Alice in Wonderland upside down world. I'm sorry about you having to live next door to your neighbors, I've been there, done that.
By the way, yeah, try to enter Mexico illegally and live there. You'll be thrown in jail. rated.
I have horrid neighbors, too (complete with loud music, screaming kids, and the ubiquitous pot smoking). I spend much of my home time with headphones on.
I find your title so interesting -- I want to say that I don't consider your feeling to be a Republican thing, but rather a "break both federal and state laws and then deal with the consequences" -- a sort of A + B = C kind of thing, but then I'm left looking at the Dem side, shaking my head. You're unfortunately right -- we've got to be PC and all get along and sing kumbaya under that view, and then you'd be called a racist for wanting your law-breaking neighbors deported.
How did we get here?
"rental properties in residential neighborhoods need to still be treated by the landowners as their responsibility..."
Deborah, absorb is a good choice of words. And our sponge is full. Didn't think about trying to move to Mexico...I'm sure that would be a scary proposition.
Amy, thank you. My situation is alright now. I made it alright. After years of work. It's tolerable and the most imposing problems have been remedied...but as I mentioned in the piece, I'm still not alright with it.
Oddly, this is a Republican area, and they keep it on the down low with their illegals because they use them for cheap labor. I know, our business is next to one of these kinds of businesses, and we know some of the illegals and their histories. Some are fugitives from their own penal system and hiding out here. No, this is not a big city, it is a little rural city in the middle of the midwest, flanked by farm area. So let me tell you if they bothered to give these people guest worker status as they once did in Europe with people who came to do jobs that others did not want, we would get some regulation in place and some way to handle issues of taxing, licensing and legal conformance, you know, HOW THE REST OF US LIVE. I completely understand what you are saying and I am at a loss how to be politically correct about it, one reason that I do not wholly consider myself of either party but currently an independent who leans very strongly democratic and liberal. But this kind of stuff, I know the back story and it is not pretty.
Check this out Beth, it is a world wide problem.
that is rudeness.
i don't care if it is illegal aliens or WASP assholes doing it.
DandyLion, I know Obama is responsible for more deportations on a monthly basis than the Bush administration, so I recognize the party contradictions. The Republican party does propose giving more power and discretion to local law enforcement, which I support since the current agencies are under-staffed and under-funded. Their self-deportation idea seems silly and unrealistic though. There was a GOP suggestion I read about where a federal electronic system would check the citizenship of any new hire. I back that. I would like something similar to apply to renters, in my case. Do you have any idea what I had to do to get an apartment in NYC? Credit checks, 3 months deposit, interviews, references, lengthy applications...people like my neighbors had to do none of that.
Plus, I liked this title best for my piece.
As a species and as a culture,we are very bad at accepting that, which is precisely why those who have taken advantage of this situation. Both the immigrants and the politicians on both sides who've deliberately chosen to allow it to happen. Republicans to placate employers, Democrats because they wanted votes, whether illegal or sympathetic ones, couldn't care less about your experience, but would that surprise anyone?
In the meantime, American policies help to prop up the corrupt governments of Mexico, enriching what is probably the .0001% of that nation, to the horrid detriment of a huge population living in poverty amidst incredible resources and under siege from drug cartels. So wrong and so sad.
The first group consists of identity politics and civil rights oriented (again on identity grounds) liberals. They want the illegals to be integrated out of multicultural, cosmopolitan, inclusive, humanitarian concerns. They want families to be together, they want everybody to be happy and secure, they see the police and INS as big nasty bullies. They also think the GOP is nativistic and xenophobic.
The second groups are the blue collar, working class labor folks. They are socially conservative, but see the illegals as an economic threat. The illegals cause a downward pressure on wages because they don't pay social security, unemployment or payroll taxes, aren't regulated, aren't unionized and the like. Legal American workers, regardless of race, often have to be paid a mandatory minimum wage on a 1099 basis, with all the employer-based taxation that entails. The employers would rather hire the illegals because its not only cheaper, but this cheapness allows them to hire more labor, thus increasing worksite productivity. (You can get 2 guys hammering nails for the price of 1).
The third group are the law and order conservatives. They just want the laws enforced and don't see why illegals should be rewarded for illegal actions. This is why they are against amnesty. Some of them may also be closet xenophobes, but not all of them. Here, though, this group is mostly opposed to the presence of the illegals out of subjective, transendental issues, rather than the objective, self-interested issues utilized by labor.
The fourth group consists of business. These interests are ultimately cynical, but like labor, they are the only objective interests here. These guys actually want the illegal immigrants to stay in America. In fact, they want more illegal immigrants. The thing is, they don't want them to become legalized. They don't want them to receive amnesty or a green card. They don't want them to get citizenship. If this happened, they would have to pay them according to a 1099 system. They would have to pay them a minimum wage. They would no longer be able to pay them under the table.
The business interests LOVE having black market labor pool upon which to draw and they want it to get bigger and bigger. The more unregulated it is, in their mind, the better.
So the only people in this fight who are objectively fighting out of economic self interest are the businesses and the working classes. Everybody else is basically arguing out of emotion and is being manipulated in the process.
Big Business plays games and says they want regulation and amnesty and a solution. But at the same time they are funding the radical xenophobic groups that prevent a solution to this problem, groups which demand deportation and harsh treatment for illegals. This is counter-intuitive, but it actually makes sense if you put yourself in the shoes of a businessman. You want to paint yourself as somebody who loves enforcement and the law, while simultaneously working to evade it while nobody is looking.
They are free riders and, other than their rhetoric, they have no incentive or real interest in fixing this system. There's simply too much money to make from keeping these people illegal and undocumented.
They are like a permanent, mobile force of exploitable, disposable human beings, to be used as Capital and Big Business see fit.
I took a course in Spanish at the local community college, and the instructor told us that up until that time, one out of four Mexicans earned his living, in one way or another, by recycling american automobiles. With increasing computerization, and built in obsolescence also becoming the norm, he said, there will be an enormous crisis in Mexico. His words seem prophetic to me now. The violence of cartels has actually made their government even more ineffective, troubled with corruption as it always was. And the Mexican people are now, more than any other time, in need of work in the United States. I know quite a few people that think that Mexicans take jobs away from legitimate american citizens. I think this is caused mostly by outsourcing by our own corporations than any other cause. The Republicans seem to think that this makes a good platform. It might prove to be popular, but it is an obfuscation, a diversion from what needs to be done.
I got to know a lot of Mexicans, mostly wealthy ones. They are very cultured, well-read people. They read more sophisticated literature than we do. On the American side, many of them suffer from a lack of education, in both languages, though they learn to speak both English and Spanish. Hence, they are more low brow, I would concede that. The problem in Arizona, and in similar areas, is that there are so many of them. The white people retreat into smaller and more exclusive groups, and lose the ability to understand the Spanish speaking people all around them. I would recommend eating more Mexican food. I think all cultural understanding starts with eating the food of other ethnic groups. Unfortunately, this will make you gain weight.
Excellent comment, Rw005g. A piece in and of itself.
Culturally, I don't have any problems with Mexico...and I love the food (the music, not so much). I often envy their tight communities as well; I don't have the same kind of tight-knit people who really have your back and help you out. Americans are too separated and disconnected to be that way, it seems.
One thing I will say culturally that I don't like (along with the music) is the male stare. In their culture, it seems to overtly stare at a woman in public is perfectly acceptable. And I'm talking more than a stare...more of a leer. I feel I have to deal with enough sexist behavior from Americans...to have to deal with another culture which deems it far more acceptable to leer definitely angers me. Because ultimately that kind of look...it's not kind or flattering; it's demeaning.
Touring Ellis Island startled me to see how little the concerns have changed in a century.
Still, turning away boat people if picked up before touching shore sickens me. That's not who we want to be as a nation, is it? Is it?
Touring Ellis Island startled me to see how little the concerns have changed in a century.
Still, turning away boat people if picked up before touching shore sickens me. That's not who we want to be as a nation, is it? Is it?
Several people had mentioned that bad neighbors are bad neighbors, regardless of their citizenship. For me, in this equation, there is "regardless of their citizenship" because its a core part of the problem. Had I bothersome legal neighbors (oh boy and have I over the years), I'd have different methods to deal with them. In short, its hard to remove that part of the equation when even if they were sterling silver neighbors, it would still bother me, their lack of legality. People's niceness, in short, ultimately has nothing to do with it.
Perhaps one of my bigger problems that I tried to touch on in this piece is that I believe we've become too accepting of an unacceptable situation. We overlook an illegal act when we shouldn't. I can tell you this: its never overlooked when it comes to me. I live in the police state of New Jersey. I'd get pulled over for driving my bike under the influence.
Gwool, I agree: turning people away seems rather heartless and an indicator of our US society as a whole that's not favorable. But I must say this: there's a certain presumptuousness when you bring the entirety of your family here, hoping it will just work out. A mighty risk.
When people are in need of political amnesty, I get it. Desperate situation, I get. But again, many if not most of the immigrants who move here do it for financial reasons and a better life, regardless of whether they become citizens or not. Again, not many crawling to the border.
Thanks, Stim. Its been a long, hard lesson.
Might the cost of implementation and enforcement exceed the benefits to be gained?
your reference to "entitlement" felt by the aliens is very relevant, however, consider how much americans are seen as arrogantly espousing entitlement attitudes by those around the world...
and by the way just the name given to them tells volumes. what are they?
- illegal immigrants
- undocumented workers
- aliens
etcetera!! there are other terms for em too right? I forget....
its a very complicated issue that basically, people dont worry about as much in an UP economy. in a brutal DOWN economy, where we've been for over 4 YEARS... it comes out more... yeah one would think the economy is not a "zero sum game" but one does doubt sometime. frankly I think "winner take all" is more the problem in our economy than "zero sum game".... but whatever... the economy is dysfunctional so we have to take it out on someone!!
Given your wish to rid the nation of illegal immigrants it really makes sense to hold a Republican point of view. After all it is Republican fiscal philosophies that have stemmed the tide of illegal immigration to the U.S.A. Since G.W.B. collapsed the economy we've lost at least a million. So let Romney get the reins and given the sad shape we're still in he should have us in a reverse illegal immigration situation within a year.
The Dominicans were friendly, community-minded (they'd tell you which kid's baseball went astray and dented your car) and loud. If you heard a neighbor's music playing, it was salsa. They'd sit on the porch in summer and not think twice about starting a shouting conversation with someone on a neighboring porch.
The rest of us were a mixed bunch.
Ultimately, you have to take the good with the bad in culture. And if your neighbors are legal, then it is a matter of culture. They're probably in your neighborhood because it is safer and the schools are better than a neighborhood where they could afford more space. They are investing in their future and their kids' future, like good Americans.
I'm not arguing that if they are illegal they should remain here. But I don't think you know.
Here in France, I know several people who are "illegal immigrants" (but who aren't, to my knowledge, shitty neighbors!) - that is, their visas or work permits have expired, and they've stayed in this country. Some do speak the language and others don't. Sometimes that's because they don't have time or feel able to learn another language (and as a language teacher I can vouch that a certain percentage of the adult population truly will not be able to learn more than a few rudimentary vocabulary words and phrases).
The reason why these people are here, is similar to why the Mexicans you write about come to America: a better life. Are these people starving in their home countries? In most cases, probably not. But then again, if you were unhappy about where you live, be it because you couldn't earn enough to live life at the level you wanted, because of crime, because of the political regime, because of poor sanitation or education opportunities or civil rights issues, or countless other things, you'd probably try to move, right?
A hundred years ago, it wasn't so hard for people to legally move to America or to France, or to many other countries. Yes, there were some restrictions in place, but not like today. I know that as a healthy, well-integrated person who speaks fluent French, has a spotless criminal record, and doesn't collect government benefits, I wouldn't be able to stay here if it weren't for being PACS'ed (civil marriage) with a French citizen. I know that immigration laws are getting stricter all the time. A few years ago, after having lived and worked here for five years, I could have gotten a permanent resident card. Now, because my individual income isn't high enough, I can't. US immigration laws are even tighter. So what do you do if you truly desire to live in the US, for whatever reason that might be?
Some of my maternal grandparents probably wouldn't have been permitted entry to the US under your (and many other people's) requirements: they never learned to speak English. Here I am, writing today, in English, the official language of the United States. My mother and her sisters are teachers, my uncle is a doctor. All speak fluent, flawless English. My grandfather was a war hero, who could have fought for the Italians, as his own father had never become a US citizen, but who fought instead for his adopted country. And yet, his parents just couldn't get a grip on English. So they spoke Italian at home, and their children (my grandfather's generation) learned English in school.
What I'm trying to say by all that is, one of the problems people have with illegal immigrants is integration - but these people will integrate, they'll have to. And if that doesn't include speaking the language, their children will solve that "problem". When we see illegal immigrants, we see a fascinating formation of new citizens in the generations to come.
I feel bad for you having neighbors who are hard to deal with - but lots of people have bad neighbors, regardless of their origin. That's a separate problem, and I don't blame you for taking action.
But it's hard for me to understand all the hatred and anger over illegal immigrants. Yes, they're doing something "wrong" -but only because the establishment has created borders and laws. It wasn't always illegal to come to America or France or any other country, if that was where you saw opportunity, or just wanted to be. As the Indigo Girls very aptly put it: "He said 'We're looking for illegal immigrants, can we check your car?' I said, 'You know it's funny, I think we were on the same boat back in 1694'."
America is a nation of immigrants, and if you examine our family's roots, many of us - especially those who've been in the US the longest - actually came here "illegally"!
*our FAMILIES' roots
Sorry - it's too early in the morning....
You sound like you are at your wit's end, and I can appreciate your frustration. I would hate to be in your shoes.
But, as you yourself wrote, there are so many layers to this problem, and a big part of the problem is the U.S. business system which has relied on cheap labor from Mexico for generations. Remember the "Bracero" program from the 1940s? While U.S. GI's (including many of my Hispanic relatives) were fighting the Nazis and Japanese in Europe and the Pacific during WWII, thousands of Mexican farm workers were "invited" to enter the U.S. to work because American women couldn't do it all on their own. Cut out the incentive for illegal immigration, and it will stop. The same is true of drugs. As many have pointed out, illegal international border crossings are a problem around the globe as the poorer nations of the south migrate to the north in search of a better life. Isolationism, guns, and hate rhetoric have never worked. The U.S. has to play a more active role in partnering with Mexico to solve this problem.
You say you want to discuss this issue without sounding like a "racist," but the tone, language, and attitude of this post (and many of the comments) borders on bigoted. Using words such as "illegals" and "aliens" to describe human beings is a way of objectifying and dehumanizing them, and making it easier to hate them. That is exactly what happened in Nazi Germany with Jewish people. I know you are not a racist, but words are powerful, and these terms are loaded. They are meant to inspire fear in the minds of people.
As for your neighbors: Yes. They are rude, and it sounds like they come from the lower classes in Mexico, and are not very sophisticated, or familiar with our way of life. However, it's patently simplistic to judge all Latin Americans by the behavior of the poor, less educated people who come here to take low-wage jobs. That would be like Latin Americans judging all Americans by the crass behavior of rednecks, and, believe me, I've seen my share of those right here in Colorado. I've also seen loud, obnoxious Americans in Latin America walking around with a sense of entitlement, like they own the world, and are superior to everyone else. The "Ugly American" is a well-known archetype around the globe.
And, no, I am not an apologist for illegal immigrants, but the train left the station a long time ago on this issue.
I'd like to hear solutions that are not hateful, Draconian, dehumanizing, and inhumane, and don't demonize Hispanic Americans who have lived on this side of the border for generations.
There is not one point of view here I don't read with appreciation and attempts at understanding. I only hope that I may be allowed that same opportunity. Its such a polarized topic that I feel the choice is either to be quiet or to be a racist. Very little in-between area to communicate. I wrote the piece predominantly for that reason, since my neighbor issues have been solved for the most part a while ago.
Deborah, I'm in agreement with you on most of your points. I'd like to see smart sound solutions and I don't judge an entire culture based on my neighbors. The terminology is frustrating because you're right; it can sound dehumanizing. In the same breath, there's a contrasting movement that seems to deny the illegality aspect with terms such as "undocumented worker."
Oh...and I'm curious what you mean when you say the "train has left long ago."
Herr, I definitely felt, in my situation, there was that "attempt to drown out your neighbors with the culture of the land you presumably were unable to live in." Which for me was the hardest part.
Myriad, you're right; this administration has been stricter when it comes to deportations per month.
Alysa, thank you for opinions and allowing room for mine. If I was unhappy where I lived, I would not move to another country hoping I would just assimilate somehow, some way. I thought for some time that I might move to Cananda. The first thing I did was research the various paths to citizenship. When I realized the difficulty, I moved within my country. There is NO WAY I'd move my entire family under the assumption that a country should just take me in. Well, I'd have to say, unless I was under dire circumstances.
As for the establishment and laws, as far as I'm concerned, they're needed. If we had no borders or no laws that defined citizenship, that would be a shitstorm of chaos. In a utopian world, that sounds wonderful. Who are we to draw borders, etc? But they have been created and we've lived within the constraints of those laws for some time.
As for the argument (that several have made) re: our great grandparents, etc., I find it difficult to respond because we live in a totally different time, economy, political climate. It's a little too apples and oranges for me. Besides we're talking about a massive number of people in an overstocked country. Check out third chart on this page:
http://www.susps.org/overview/numbers.html
Bad neighbors are one of the worst things ever, and can permeate every waking thought when home. Even when the music is off, part of you is in a constant state of contraction, waiting for it to go on again. Your neighbors sound like a nightmare, and I'd think anyone in your situation would begin to think in terms of turf.
My worst all time neighbors were an Opus Dei family with seven children born a year apart, home schooled, a husband who drank excessively, yelled and beat, and a mother who in the subfreezing February temps, locked all seven children out in the backyard to 'play' for the entire day on crusty frozen icy ground. No evidence of home schooling to be seen. They were aggressive kids, screamed and hit one another, and often crawled over my fence to wreak havoc in my yard. When I'd ask them to go home, they'd stare at me without speaking and continue what they were doing. The father would come over drunk and scream at me for speaking to them, and revealed that they were not speaking to me because he'd told them not to, even as they tore out plants and pulled down my woodpile. On Sunday mornings, they got all dressed up to go to church, and to an unknowing eye, looked like a beautiful Norman Rockwell painting.
As a result of those years, I have a bias about Opus Dei. I know the neighbors' behavior probably had less to do with their religious culture than their personalities, but some behaviors definitely unfolded from that, and while I don't know which, I am now imprinted, and think things like: no home schooling for religious fundamentalists! No EBT cards for fundamentalists who have seven kids and won't send them to public school! Get a job lady, and stop pushing another one out every year! Etc. I hate that those thoughts arise, but wouldn't I have to be a stone for them not to? You too. I hear you. But I don't want to make big fences. It's a hard issue. Talking about it in non-bumper sticker ways is good. Thanks for doing that.
Many people want it both ways... they want to claim *their* ancestors historical illegal and immoral actions on this continent are somehow "different" than the actions of current people doing the exact same thing. They aren't. What was done by those of European ancestry to those who occupied this continent ahead of the first European arriving here is NO different than what those you complain about here today are doing. Why (specifically) was it "okay" for pale skinned people to do but somehow it is not "okay" for not pale skinned people?
As I said before, I am not an apologist for illegal immigrants. I don't use the term "alien" because it is not used for all illegal immigrants across the board, only for Mexicans. How do I know this? Because I've been following this issue all my life; I have studied it in political science classes; and have been personally affected by it solely because I am of Hispanic origin, and have a Spanish surname.
The haters are whipping up so much vitriol over Hispanics because of this issue, that it has affected all of us, whether we are illegal immigrants or Hispanics whose families have lived here in the U.S. legally for generations. Ironically, my family history in this country predates the founding of the U.S. government on my Spanish side. On my Pueblo Indian side my family has lived her for millennia. Mexico didn't just magically appear one day. It is literally attached to the U.S., and is on the same continent, and it's been this way since the 1500s. Our histories and destinies are linked for all eternity, and resorting to hate speech, stereotyping, and demonizing of an entire nation and culture doesn't accomplish anything. Instead of bellyaching about the problem, a bigger person, one with higher moral ground, would seek positive solutions. Building walls, murdering men, women and children, locking people up, ignoring the problem, or allowing ourselves to be filled with hatred are not the answers, either.
Here's what I mean by "the train left the station a long time ago": Moaning and groaning isn't working. The U.S. and Mexico need to put their hands together and come up with a long-term solution that works for both sides. As long as Mexico remains poor and filled with drug violence, people will continue to flood over the U.S.-Mexico border. As long as U.S. employers are willing to employ illegal immigrants, people will continue to risk life and limb to come to the U.S. As long as U.S. authorities continue to turn a blind eye to illegal immigration, the problem will continue.
But hating people isn't the answer. It only makes the hater look smaller. ... By the way: Have you read the historical documentation of how earlier Americans described, thought of, and treated the Irish and other immigrants from Europe? The rhetoric is stunningly similar, and very degrading. This is a very, very, very old story.
One of my favorite expressions: Poor Mexico, so far from God, so close to the United States.
But again, I think the whole "your great great grandparents did it" argument is just a little too simplistic for me and comparing two vastly different situations. Amd even if they were the same situation and comparable, then again, I maintain, two wrongs don't make it right.
Jackie2, there is nothing wrong with being a Republican and all should be welcome here. We've all become so polarized that OS should be an even playing field for any who enter. We should practice what we preach. My point with the title of the piece means that I don't have to adhere to EVERY liberal belief.
vzn, yes, I agree; this issue feels more pressing in a down economy. I recently read an article that debunked the whole "illegal workers take jobs that Americans don't want" mindset...in this economy, more of those American workers do in fact want those jobs for their survival, especially people who haven't completed high school.
What if they were Asian? Nigerian?, Ethiopian? East European? Would you still be rankled by their potential "illegality"? I think that if you are only concerned about their legal status because they are "Mexican", then you might be experiencing some racist feelings, which by no means makes you a racist, but might be something you want to search your heart about.
On the other hand, I have had trouble with bad neighbors as well and if I had thought that I could be rid of them by having them deported I would have followed up on it happily. Unfortunately, you apparently can't get people deported to New Jersey! Joke, just a joke!
Seriously, if you have real suspicions about whether your neighbors are here legally or not, you can contact immigration services and find out for sure.
Marc
Problem is, you're not angry at the party who damaged you. You're angry at their instruments of damage.
Who rented the house? If they had not done that, would this situation that you're forced to accept have been possible?
Getting pissed is fine, but you noted causation and then railed against the effect instead of the cause.
That's gonna get you frustrated every time.
It's cool...most people are self-loathers.
Abrawang and others, I had responded and lost them. I'll try to rewrite. Right now, will start from the bottom up.
jlsathre, I agree with you; this has been, for the most part, a surprisingly civil discussion. It gives me hope. (Then again, I guess I knew OS members are good like that. They can disagree, they can get angry...but we still engage and that has to be helpful, right?)
Terry McKenna, after doing a good deal of research on this, I do believe there is some benefit to an electronic verification system. My situation has been fairly manageable, but let's just say a crime occurred...I don't even know my neighbor's names. They're not on the lease. They have little legal accountability right now. If you read Sheila's comment, you'll see the implications there.
Malcolm XY, as I mentioned in my piece, one is quickly forced into a corner when you discuss this issue: you're either racist or you're on the "oh so politically correct" side. There's no in-betweens. Which is a shame and just off target: because I am in-between. And I don't loathe myself! Ha...I like myself a little too much at times.
Please note from my piece that I'm irate at the homeowner who has turned a total blind eye to this situation. I'm also angry at the business owner, whose name is conveniently on a lease of a house he hasn't even set foot in and has NO clue of the repercussions of his act. I'm mad at our local government who listened to me, agreed with me, and then did nothing. So trust me, my anger lands on all parties.
Linn, sure, that's the case. If no one is around to check your actions and your names are not on the lease, many will take liberties.
Marc Lyman, I stand by my point: this is not just a case of bad neighbors; the illegality aspect comes into play. How could it not? If I lived next to a psychopath, would his mental health not be an issue? I also said in the piece that whether its the Pope or Martians (okay, I said Lilliputians), I'd take issue if they were here illegally. But again, if you bring up the illegal element, many instantly stamp "racist" on you...which is insulting and unfair...and frankly, just as bigoted as what I'm being accused of. There needs to be SOME ROOM for people to have issues with illegal immigrancy without being racist. I insist on that room and resent any implications otherwise. I could sit here and "prove" to you how unracist I am by the neighborhoods I've lived in, people I've dated, countries I've visited, causes I represent...but I won't. I'm tired of that kind of silly battle.
(Oh and I was told by the realtor that it was a Mexican family. I do recognize other countries exist south of the border.)
Well they don't actually have Rabies. Your obnoxious neighbors could just as easily been obnoxious white trailer trash. That wouldn't make a difference about how you feel about the situation would it?
I didn't call you a racist, I suspect you are no more racist than I, but that does not mean that I do not experience racist thoughts and feelings. How could I not, having been born in a racist city, in a racist state, in a racist country raised by the racist children of racist parents? The trick is to rise above that early training. That's what that wrinkly thing between your ears is for.
That being said, I still haven't heard your answer about whether you would have the same "illegality" issues if your neighbors were not Mexican. That is still the question I would like for you to answer if you would.
There is no doubt that we have problems in this country with jobs, healthcare, and poverty. We also have problems with immigration law. However, correlation does not imply causality. There are many more causal factors in the job/healthcare/poverty problems than are dreamed of in the Republican philosophy that illegal immigrants are taking up all our jobs, and welfare!
Not trying to change your mind, just expand it a little bit.
"Friends don't let friends vote Republican"
I wish I could gather up all the Americans and get us all to say, in unison, it’s not ok to immigrate illegally. Unfortunately, many of the people who are children of illegal immigrants just don’t see it that way and they are now voters so, how could they see it any other way. It’s impossible to ask a human to be that reasonable, rationale or honest. We just don’t work that way.
Marc, I did answer your question and the answer is also in the piece, where I say I don't care if it was the Pope or Lilliputians, if they're here illegally, I find it problematic.
And OE, thanks for your comments. I tried to differentiate this in the piece but it goes like this: if it were a group of college frat boys partying, being obnoxious, I'd deal with it on a totally different level.
But ultimately it's kind of like comparing apples and oranges. Their illegality has very much been part of the problem. Truth be told, it's more frustrating when your life is in total upheaval by people who aren't even legal citizens...I resent having to "fix" the problem that much more. As I did in the piece, living next to a drug dealer would be a closer equivalent. People might find that extreme, but I have lived next to a drug dealer. There's a lot of covert activity and flagrant bucking of the system.
Abrawang, I'm sure you're gone by this point but I did respond and I'll have to summarize now. Yes, I do believe in stronger borders. No, I don't believe in everything the Republicans party extols re: immigration. But the Democrats don't seem to have any plan in place. My point being: I find myself having more conservative views when it comes to immigration, not everything. (I said it a lot better before...before my comment disappeared!)
Alysa, I've been thinking about what you said re: language. I also do believe if you're going to move to a whole new country (and definitely if you're there illegally) you should learn the language. I know I would, even if took years. Because of this: several of the major problems I had with my neighbors at first were based on them not understanding me. Communication breakdown, based on language issues. There are some major implications when you don't understand the language of the host country. Besides, doesn't it just show proper respect to learn the language? I'd want to.
Actually you have not answered the question I have been trying to ask - most probably because I haven't asked it clearly. Let's try this - if your neighbors had the same behaviors, but did not look Hispanic - let's say they were black or Asian, would you have the same suspicion that they were in the country illegally? Or, to put it another way, do you equate "illegal" with "Mexican"?
On a humorous note, please join me in keeping a close eye out for that most elusive of illegals, the illegal Canadian! Carefully check all of your white neighbors and look for ones that may be a little too white! I mean it is easy to sympathize with them being here to escape the double scourge of national healthcare and pensions, but we can't rob our own people of the freedom to die young and poor to "make up" for the wrongs perpetrated upon "them" by other nations!
And if people are moving back to their home country based on a downturned economy, it only proves the economic opportunism based on many people's moves.
tmarclyman, I wonder if I could possibly write a piece about my feelings re: immigration without the lurking insinuations that there simply must be some latent racism behind it that you're hoping to uncover.
I equated "illegal" with their very "illegal-like" behavior, not their skin color. But I think what you me to admit to is: "Yes, yes, it's their brown skin. I just KNEW they were illegal based on their brownness. It simply wreaked of illegality." So still, the onus of proof is on me to prove to you that they are illegal instead of looking at the problem, which is very real, take it or leave it.
I do appreciate your points but do you see how MY behavior or observations are questioned even though I (underlined) clearly was the person, for YEARS, who had to endure a difficult situation, most likely based on someone's illegality here? In short, I'M the victim who had to fight tooth and nail to make this situation sane and now I have to prove to you why I'm angry about it.
It's hard for you to see it, because I sense you're trying to "catch me" (and have problem not encountered what I did, firsthand). But the deal is: my general peace was disrupted. And I simply wanted to maintain my quality of life, not write to you or anyone about this years down the line. (I like writing about much sillier topics than this. Candy, boys, puppies...that's my jam.)
So I wonder, just wonder, whether you would ever question these presumed illegal and/or legal people the same way you'd question me, where they'd have to prove to you their "real" motivations? I somehow doubt that. I'm the suspect suddenly.
These people exhibited many telltale signs of people living here illegally. I cannot ask them their citizenship status. That's illegal. So does that mean I'm to make NO assumptions ever and just tolerate? Isn't that part of the problem? (Where the discussion is either "put up with it or you're racist.")
According to stats I read, one in 3 immigrants here are illegal. Most illegal immigrants stem from South American countries, not Canada (who the heck would leave?) So it's not some HUGE leap to assume that they just may be illegal. But if you're asking for ironclad proof, you won't get it, because it's not legally permitted. That doesn't make me have any less issue with it.
I hope that answers your question.
Now back to candy and puppies.
That said, in contrast to the child tax credit that people are upset about, it's also exceedingly well-documented that illegal immigrants contribute to Social Security. "According to Social Security Administration data, undocumented workers pay between $6 billion and $7 billion into the Social Security trust fund each year. That comes on top of Medicare and unemployment insurance taxes the illegal workers pay on the more than $72 billion in wages employers reported paying to individuals without Social Security numbers in 2009—the latest data available from the Social Security Administration."
Frankly, I've had a very different experience than you living among Mexican families in the U.S. And as someone who would very much like her social security when she retires in a couple of decades, I don't understand why we are not welcoming the children, especially those who are going to college and joining the military and holding jobs, with open arms.
I also get frustrated that the whole debate centers on Hispanics. There are plenty of illegals in the U.S. who are lily white. If the bartender at your local Irish bar speaks with a brogue, he or she is probably here illegally and working under the table. I knew quite a few back in my drinking days and they were up front that everyone assumed they were here legally simply because they were white.
500words, I've said this about a 1/2 dozen times: "Whether it’s the Mexican family next door or the Pope or a Lilliputian, if you’re here illegally, you’re committing a crime." In this case, it IS a Mexican family; I can't help that.
Several doors down, there is a similar situation every summer where a local business hires several young women from Eastern Europe and shoves them all in one apartment (none of their names are on the lease either). Last summer, they did a lot of damage to the apartment (that affected the apartment below as well). The owner of the business did pay for it but they were back again this summer. Not sure why.
As for the contributions to the economy, that is a very debated topic and really, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to look at the situation and see that they're not simply contributing to the economy; it's just not that simple. They're also using social services. And welfare. And occupying jails (15% of the jail population). And taking advantage of massive tax loopholes. And sending tons of money back to their home country (not necessarily just spending it here). And their kids are in schools, which costs money obviously.
And of course, THE BIG ONE, they're NOT all paying taxes. Many do, but I know the business owners here personally (several of them); they're being paid under the table routinely. I mean, most of us know that, right?
I can't help but wonder about these economic studies as well. At this point, all "studies" are suspect to me, depending on whose paying for them and what their political motivations are.
And guess what? I'll default to my example in my piece. Drug dealers, it could be argued, contribute to the economy. Keep local gangs active, busy, spending money...does it make it any more legal? (An exaggeration to make a point.) And what's the breaking point? When are there so many people living here illegally that it no longer "helps the economy?" 12 million? 40 million? 200 million? And if they are helping the economy so much, why aren't we feeling the effects? As a recent commenter pointed out, many are leaving because our economy is downturned. So that "help" isn't simply defined, my point.
What if someone got a box of Los Cucarachas, in keeping with our theme, and dumped them all in your kitchen.
At whom does it make sense to get angry, Los Cucarachas, or the asshole who dumped them in your kitchen.
Obviously, those pesky Cucarachas are going to be the objects of your ire as they are scrambling into the kitchen closets, waiting to spread disease throughout your house, but once you have some time to reflect, if you allow yourself to be angry at them instead of the actual culprit, you're not an insectist - you're just stupid.
Worse yet, directing blame at the wrong party will NEVER solve the problem and give you back your home.
My personal experience in discussing the need to deal with the immigration problem by going after the root of it, namely employers who are providing the jobs, often paying cash to workers, or the large industries like hospitality that simply take advantage of the incredibly weak documentation requirements to continue hiring low paid illegals results in making my Republican friends quite upset. They don't want anything causing any problems for any employer that might effect their profits, ever. They want the workers punished and gotten out of the country. The simple truth is that if getting work here were not so easy, then we would not have the problem. Same thing with housing, same thing with all of it. If as a country we are not willing to hold those accountable who are profiting from the breaking of the immigration laws, then why should we be angry with those that are answering our call to come here to make money, papers or no.
I am all for reform, and that includes making it possible for people to come here and work legally, and it includes severe economic penalties for those that are taking advantage of undocumented workers.
And I'm not a republican.
People who live in communities has responsibilities to that community, whether the are natural-born or naturalized citizens or they are illegal resident. (The word alien suggests little fantasy creatures like E.T.; these are human beings) When they park their cars on the front lawn, make too much noise, fail to supervise their children, etc., their status with the INS is irrelevant. That's what the local ordinances and law enforcement are for, and the dirty looks be damned.
There are immigration laws in this country that nobody wants to spend the money or human resources to enforce. If we focus on that, the REAL problem, we don't have to concern ourselves with the motivations of those who come here outside the law. People tend to do what they are able to get away with doing, unfortunately. And I do tend to believe the vast majority of illegal residents from Mexico are fleeing starvation and violence rather than coming for the sport of "working the system."
Lezlie
Malcom XY, thanks for your Los Cucarachas theme. Any levity at this point is needed...ha. But again, if you read my last response to you, I stated that I'm MORE than unhappy with the realtor, the business owner and for me, particularly, the 75 year-old woman who owns the house, whom I've known ever since I was a small child.
Doesn't make me look good, does it? Being mad at an elderly woman...but she's turned a total blind eye to this. And I resent her for that. Probably most of all. (A long back story there that I won't get into; but she made herself invisible several times throughout the most problematic periods, yet still cashed a rent check every month.)
So I get it. As aim pointed out, I think there are far bigger, more nefarious puppeteers at play here. With that said, that doesn't make me any LESS angry with my neighbors...they disregarded my simple requests and acted as if if I were a pesky annoyance until I brought the law into it.
Lorijeanean, thanks for your story and feedback. Your family story is undoubtedly like many others. And thanks for using the phrase "gaming the system"...I've been struggling for that phrase for some time.
aim, the gig went pretty well! Though we were rained out after the second set...a drag. Oh well, it's summer, what do you do? But I felt good overall. Thank you.
That being said, I'm not above a "how many Mexicans can you fit in a VW bug?" joke. Them shits is funny.
sounds kind of old-fashioned and quaint and very middle america in the 1950s in the hot summer.
they send money back so their families can live better lives. if you had a family, you might do the same thing. seems to me, most would. and certainly, "house stuffing" is a big part of that. they feel entitled to cram themselves into uncomfortable living situations so that those left at home can live better than they are. its a sense of entitlement, but not one i would like to experience.
There is also the tyranny of the minimum wage. Since it hasn't been raised since the 1990s, it's substantially under the poverty line now even if you have a 40 hour per week job. And in order for illegals to survive in America, it's often necessary for them to have three shifts of workers living in one house -- again doing jobs that nobody else wants.
Again, I'm sorry that you had to suffer. But do not generalize. I've run into illegals who are operating their own businesses and have been doing so for twenty years. There are all kinds of illegals, perhaps even a few blue eyed, blond haired Swedes.
No one complains of the average $14 extra we pay for a tank of gas (and that's a conservative guess) just to fund oil speculators, i.e. investment banks and hedge funds. Not to mention the ripple effect of higher transportation costs. We're being sucked dry in so many ways by carrying the rich it's hard to document them all.
I saw a movie a couple of years ago on a town that got tough on illegal immigrants, passing some of the toughest laws in the country. They got what they wanted, for they too hated their new neighbors. But as they kicked them out they kicked out their economy, businesses shuttering and real estate collapsing.
So maybe the question is would you give up your job for quieter neighbors?
And of course the reality is, there's no such thing as an immigrant. We are one world, one people on this planet; borders a fiction of our minds. Just because we refuse to face that doesn't make it any less so.
I have also come to know many undocumented aliens who are, for want of a better term, using the system and taking far more from our tax dollars than they are contributing to society. Those people, who certainly do exist, are those most targeted by the immigration opponents.
Then again, I could easily say the same about many of the U.S. citizens whom I see walking the halls of our state's county courthouses and walking/driving streets throughout New Jersey, and other, states. Many are hard-working people, working long hours to support a family in a difficult economy. Many others are content to stay at home, work as little as possible, and yet still believe that they are entitled to reap the benefits of others' efforts. So this is certainly not an issue simply reserved for Mexicans or other undocumented people. It is a problem that has become an epidemic in this country, both for people with proper credentials and without.
Malcolm XY, my neighbors weren't the easy target at all. When I first had problems, I went to the realtor and the home owner. Unfortunately, my neighbors became the more immediate problem, making it hard not to dedicate some anger their way (ever wake up at 5 am to someone beeping in front of your window every day? And then when you ask them nicely to stop, they ignore you?) But yes, I hear you. And I think I did look at the broader scope of this problem. Thanks for your feedback by the way and sticking around. Might be closing the comments soon because I'm answering the same thing again and again.
daisyjane, we have children ALL around here. it's one thing when they play for a few hours then go in at around 7 or 8 and it's quiet. It's another thing when its a collective of children from around the neighborhood and surrounding neighborhoods, screaming and running around until late while the parents sit inside, blissfully unconcerned.
Our small town shares a good amount of common courtesy, I think. I understand children playing. I used to be one of them. (FYI: Our houses are only yards apart from one another.)
And if houses are being crammed so they can better the lives of their families back home (and worsen the lives of their neighbors while they're here), that doesn't sound fair. Or even legal. (Most leases are very clear about the amount of people who are allowed in a house.)
Old new lefty, I definitely addressed your issue via my piece and my comments. I'm not confused at all and have been just as frustrated with the home owner and the realtor (and our local government; I've spoken with the mayor about this).
And I agree it's an international problem with big money behind it. I get that.
To say that most illegal workers here "generally" pay their taxes is a bit off. That's very hard to calculate considering they're not in the system and many are paid under the table. Plus, once they pay taxes, they can and do take advantage of tax credits for children not even living here (I cited an article in the piece about that exploitation.) So it's not that simple; when you're not legally acccounted for in the system, it's damn hard to say "57.4% of all illegal workers pay their taxes." Based on what figure? What census? In short, we're talking about many people who are living under the radar so how can we have such accurate economic figures?
And again, let's say in a perfect world, they're all paying their taxes. They're still here illegally. It doesn't negate that fact. (Again, I wish there was as much of allowance for me when I break a law.)
So I don't think I generalized at all. I looked at this situation from my perspective and I also looked at the bigger picture to the best of my ability, with other parties addressed.
I've noticed that there's been such a concern that I make my points "just so" in this politically perfect and correct manner that my points go overlooked, even ignored, as several are more concerned with tagging me with some racist underpinning than realizing I just may simply have issues with illegal immigrants living in our country. That's allowed right?
Oh and as far as the lettuce picking/Arizona example? There are new "studies" that show that based on our poor economy, those jobs that no one wanted but the illegal workers? Other citizens actually DO want them now (particularly high school drop-outs.) And if big companies are exploiting workers for less pay, that's wrong, regardless of who is doing the shitty job.
Cheshyre, I'd love to live in a world with no borders...but they exist. We can't simply wish them away and they do have implications. Citizenship in a country has very direct meaning every day of our lives.
And I am complaining about the gas. And I see this immigration problem as another way that big business is being served without any concern about the societal implications.
Would I give up my job for quieter neighbors? That seems like a massive stretch. I shouldn't have to. I didn't ask for this trade-off, it was placed upon me. I simply wanted a reasonably peaceful quality of living.
Luckily, I do have it now, because I leveraged the law in my direction. (One of the good lessons amidst this situation; I learned a LOT about local ordinances.)
I truly do appreciate all of your feedback and hope you can make some allowance for my views as I have for yours.