C Berg

C Berg
Location
Iowa, United States
Birthday
January 26
Bio
Wondering who I am, in a world that no longer knows what it is, in a country that is not what it should be, belonging to a race that is for the rats.

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AUGUST 15, 2009 2:25PM

Carted off by Police, and In Trouble Again

Rate: 39 Flag

 Carted off by Police, and in trouble again.  Before you see me on FOX NEWS or in the Cedar Rapids Gazette, let me tell you what REALLY happened at the Loebsack's Town Hall Meeting in Cedar Rapids that left me with a twisted knee and crying as I left the meeting.

There were over five hundred people at the meeting, more of them doctors and doctor's wives than I have seen in one place at one time anywhere except the medical society meetings at the Country Club.  As a former doctor's wife, many of my old friends waved and talked to me.  Susan Haupt and her husband Dr. David walked in with me, talking about horses.  Sue asked if I was here to raise a ruckus, as they were.  I said that I hoped I wouldn't have to.  So much for that.

The mood in the room was charged.  A few right-wingers started chanting, and health care reformers tried to out-shout them.  It seemed to be divided about evenly.  

I sat toward the front, with anti-reformists behind me, and to my right and in front were two large men.  The man beside me, Mr. Weems owner of Legacy Manufacturing was loudly vocalizing against everything Obama.  

 "I pay eighty employees and provide health insurance for them and this will make it so that I can't do that."

"Death sqads are mandated."  

"The government can't run anything...look at the post office...Amtrack..."  

I mention that the Post Office is privitized, as is Amtrack.  He and his friend yell at me, "NO  IT'S NOT." And they keep that up.  They keep yelling at me while I'm trying to write my question on the paper to be entered into the question lottery.

This whole thing makes me angry.  His yelling at me and being able to shout me down made me angry.  His yelling "Liar, liar," at Loebsack made me angry.  My former friends the doctors made me angry when they kept yelling at me about how they treated people with no health insurance all the time and didn't charge them.  If that were the norm, it would be great, but it's not the norm.  Even when we do have health insurance, we get charged, and the bills sent for Collection if they are not paid promptly where we are harrassed and harrassed until we pay.

You know how I feel about this health care system.  It's become a road to wealth for doctors, insurers, drug companies, hospital administrators, and medical equipment manufactures.  It has become a road to ruin for the common working person.

I was determined to stand my ground, but was definately being shouted down, so I put my sign in front of the Loud Man's face, so he grabbed it, and we strugged over the "Health Care for All," sign.  I pulled and couldn't get it away from him.  I was yelling at him as loud as I could, saying, "GIVE ME MY SIGN."  I pulled so hard that I fell on the floor and twisted my left knee.   I felt like stabbing the guy with my pen or taking a wild swing at him, but I didn't.  

The sign was the excuse, the anger was fear and intimidation.  I felt that as a woman against this white male establishment  there was no way I could communicate with  them my own frustration with the system, and that their shouting would always be louder than mine because they were/are stronger.  

My knee is starting to swell, and I feel hopeless to change this entrenched system that is only working for the VERY wealthy. 

Two police officers, a man and a woman pushed their way through the seated crowd, and asked me if I was okay, and what happened.  I told them I didn't really know  what happened.  The Shouting Man was still shouting and refusing to leave the auditorium when they asked him to.  When I made another reply to the Shouting Man's shouting, the female officer asked both of us to step outside the auditorium.  I immediately got up and went with her, leaving the male officer and the Shouting Man to follow.  

The officer pulled me away from the Shouting Man, who was still arguing, and I was replying.  She was firm about the rules of engagement.  She told me I could not use my sign to stop him, and that he could shout as much as he wanted and I could not interfere with his shouting.  After just a few minutes, she said if we could agree to stay out of each other's way, we could go back in to our seats beside each other.  We both agreed to stay out of each other's way, but neither of us would change seats.  I guess we are both stubborn idiots.

As we resumed our seats, a woman asked me HOW I was allowed to come back in!  I said to her, "We BOTH were."   A gray haired lady two rows up with a small sign that said simply,

CARE  FOR  EVERYONE

turned around in her chair and smiled at me. She kept asking me throughout the rest of the meeting if I was okay.  I said yes, and it was a good thing because I'd never get a doctor in this town again.

 The craziest thing about it is.....there were so many people on both sides of the aisle who asked me if I was okay after my fall.   

There were smiles and even hugs from total strangers.  Dr. Haupt stopped me and asked if I was hurt.  Several friends who I didn't see at first caught my eye and smiled and gave me a thumbs-up.

One young man said, "you're just passionate!"   He gave me a hug, and I accepted it.  I limped out of the auditorium.

In the hallway, another large man stopped me and said, "I don't agree with you, but I want to appologize for what happened in there.  It wasn't right."  

I said. "I just want everyone to be taken care of....I want us to all get along."    I'm afraid with the current media and entrenched political system we are constantly pitted against each other.  And I fell right into it.

Clark Reike was right.  I'm not a very good pacifist.  

 

 

As to the meeting itself, I was really impressed with Dave Loebsack and his staff.  

He maintained his cool, invited the disagreement.  

He said it was okay even if we were brought to the meeting by emails from our respective specail interest groups because that was the American Way.  

He accepted both boos and cheers and a standing ovation from his supporters with good grace and humor.  

He even allowed my Heckelers Buddy next to me to continue heckling him through the rest of the meeting.

The questions were selected from the basket AT RANDOM by members of the audience.  There were questions and statements from both sides of the disagreement.  

One other thing I am certain of:

No minds were changed.

No additional information was absorbed by either side, even when it was presented rationally.

It gave people a chance to blow off steam, but not in a way to reduce the pressure on the pressure cooker.  

I'm glad I went.  

My daughter Natalie was proud of me.  She believes in standing up for what is right.   And, I do too.  

"Care for Others," is right. 

 

 

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Thanks Brian. Canadians know it best. Now I'm going to spend the afternoon listening to jazz with my health care friends...
I'm afraid the most telling part of your piece is that no minds were changed. And this is where we're at, the reds and the blues again; shouting to be heard and no one changing their minds. ...all mixed up in the melting pot, our government representing the financial and insurance industries; and the people are heard, shouting...
If you only knew how crazy you all look to us up here. Not you personally Carol, but the whole darn thing. Wow. We won this battle 60 years ago, and it was much the same. I have a post on this in the works. I will add it to the feed later.

Take care of yourself.

~sigh~
I am so glad you survived the fracas! I am wondering if anyone would have been concerned/helped you if they didn't know you. That's what scares me.
Thanks for posting this. I hope you're okay.

I attended Senator Cardin's town hall meeting at Towson University last Monday. Had some very interesting conversations with folks there.

http://open.salon.com/blog/xylocopa/2009/08/10/theyre_as_mad_as_heck_and_theyre_not_gonna_take_it_anymore
"I just want everyone to be taken care of....I want us to all get along."
Sounds a bit like Rodney King!
I am a bit surprised by the lack of civility in Iowa. And I'm surprised at a reasonably well educated electorate being taken in by such patently false and demogogic buzz phrases as "death squads". Have conservatives become so jaded as to actually believe that such a thing is possible in this country?
Additionally, in all the years I lived and worked in Iowa I, like most others, was a staunch supporter of both Tom Harkin and Chuck Grassley even though my politics were closer to Harkin. But I always found Grassley to be a man of his principles and could respect him for that. It seems as though he has swallowed much of the "party line" on this issue. Is he not aware that this health care reform could actually be a good thing for many farmers in terms of the ability to secure affordable health insurance for their families? Farmers have always been like independent contractors who have to "pass" medical underwriting while working in a fairly hazardous profession.

And, I wanted to thank you for this post. It puts a true face on what indeed is transpiring in these "town hall meetings". Freedom of speech and assembly is apparently a right reserved only for those who agree with us.
If the ultra-rich who control everything in this country can keep us bickering and fighting amongst ourselves, they can do whatever they want, force government and channel money in any direction they choose. Until we're able to present a united front and demand fair and equitable opportunity for all, we're doomed to have nothing.

That said, change will happen in time, and the result will eventually surprise even those who think they're in charge. We as a civilization have hit the reset button - now comes the changes we've wanted for a long time. It's the transition time that's hardest.
Carol
You are heard beyond the craziness. I admire your tenacity, your courage. I pray this debate[?] doesn't derail needed reform. rAted!
Care for all... This entire situation has become so frustrating and is building into a frenzy where nothing productive will come out of it and if it continues the way it is, it will probably end in devastation. The other crime was that the heckler was probably paid to be there.
I still believe that there is hope.
thanks
rated
Oh Carol I'm so sorry you got injured. This is such a sad, first-hand look at a situation of such anger and hysteria. Thank you for reporting from the front lines. And nobody probably changes their minds much, alas.
OMG! You're nearly famous! The link here must be referring to your dust-up: http://gazetteonline.com/local-news/2009/08/15/loebsack-gets-earful-from-raucous-town-hall-crowd.

That such heckling and repugnant behavior would be allowed in a public meeting is beyond me. It prevents any real dialogue from occurring.
That loud mouth should be sooo proud of himself, causing a lady to be hurt. On the other hand, you have every right to be proud of yourself standing up to creeps such as that :>]
thank you for your courage and tenacity! Hope your knee is better! Got insurance? in case you have to go to the emergency room? Yep! Care for all!!!!!
I hope your knee is okay. No minds were changed. On either side. Too bad, right? I hate that we have become an angry mob.
Thanks to everyone for commenting....and my knee is still swelling, but I'll be damned if I go to a doctor for it.

Bruce, I love what JK said in her post in quoting the father of their system....that we are all mice, and we have elected cats to rule us. Where is help when you need it?

JK, Thanks for your excellent post on the Canadian system. With the frenzy Fox & company has created, we're more likely to have another murder than agreement on this plan. I'm still going to forward your post to everyone I know, even though the Right won't believe a word of it since it doesn't agree with them about how bad Canadians have it.

Emma, Thanks for your comment and concern. Even though my knee hurts, I'm seriously considering organizing a protest outside the hospitals in the area. Healthcare was the number one concern in the election...how come now it's 'status quo full speed ahead?'

Thanks Patrick! I'm happy to see it's possible to still have conversations!

Walter, This craziness is shocking to say the least, especially in Iowa. I think it is totally the Far Right TV pundits who are fanning the flames of descent and insiting normal people to acts of domestic terrorism. If it were Bush in power, he would have them beheaded. Why does Obama think that they will be reasonable when led by Rush Limbaugh?

Umbrella, You are right. Our civilization is not working on many many levels, and we are setting the reset button. There may come a time when the Rich can't buy their way out of it. I think that time is now.

Mr. Mustard, Yes, yes, yes. We desparately need reform. I pray our elected officials have the courage to do the right thing and not cave-in to special interests.

Mical, I do still have hope, too. But only if the rest of us can be heard over the Right-wing's shouting!

Lea, Just hearing from the people here on OS gives me hope for the future of this nation, and this world. Thank you for caring.

Steve, Thanks for the link to the Gazette article. Yep, the little altercation was mine. Not so famous, but that's fine. Ouch.

Ric, I have no doubt Loud Mouth is very proud of himself. He couldn't hold back his self-satisfied smile as he returned to his heckling. I'm afraid chivalry is a thing of the past, at least for this man.

Fab...maybe if we say it enough, it will happen....care for all, care for all, care for all, care for all.

GracieLou. Definately the mob mentality at work. My friend, Tom, sitting 3 rows behind me, who is a Green Party activist said that the woman next to him said that she was scared. He said to her, "I am too." What kind of a "meeting" is it when the people attending are scared by the violence of the crowd---in Iowa, no less.

Thank you again for the love and support. It helps so much! Carol
Carol...oh my goodness! This is complete madness...I'm glad you were there to stand up for us! xox
This made me teary, Carol. I'm worried about what's going to happen because this is just escalating. I'm so very sorry that you were injured, but also very proud that you stood up for what you believe in. I admire you.
Just awful. So depressing. And it boils down to one thing: greed.

Sorry Carol. Thanks for alerting me to this post.

denese
Mice 'n cats... It's an apt metaphor, isn't it...? JK's piece on Tommy Douglas and the Canadian medical system is really inspiring, isn't it...?
Wow, you actually went to one of those things without a Kevlar vest? Kudos. The quote I love the most is from that yahoo who said something like: "I don't want the government controlling Medicare." No shortage of dumbasses.

Rated.
Carol, you are a good, brave woman. Here's the Register's take on it. You're mentioned, but not by name. http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/index.php/2009/08/15/loebsack-faces-concerned-yet-respectful-crowd/

If you want to be involved in a peaceful protest next week when Senator Grassley attends the state fair, let me know, I can hook you up. It's being organized by several groups throughout Iowa. I think there are buses coming from Davenport and Iowa City or CR.

I sincerely respect your passion for this, Carol. It's been a brutal week here and all over the country on HCR.
Good job Carol. It must have been kind of weird seeing all your medical establishment friends and then you on the other side of the aisle. Sounds like a rough crowd. I am so pleased to see that you went to the meeting and voiced your support of health care for all. I hope you're healing fast.
While I, as a youth worker in a residential treatment facility, am used to getting screamed at, threatened and occasionally punched (though by children ages 5-12), I don't know if I could have handled that situation. I have tons of patience but if I was there I would have punched that guy. Hit me, insult me, humiliate me all you want but if you lay a finger on my family or friends... I don't even know what I would do! I could punch him! I am glad you are ok and got to participate in this even though this happened.

You know my situation; 27 years old, relatively healthy, got some blood pressure problem and passed out at work twice so ended up having to spend the night in the hospital. I didn't go in the ambulance despite lots of pressure from the boss to avoid that bill, but even WITH health insurance, making $19K a year and one night in the hospital with tests and I have been trying to pay off nearly $4,000 in medical bills a year later. The system sucks, God and Obama help me!
Love you Mom!
I am proud of you. With all those doctors around someone could have looked at your knee ;0)
oh god, sweetheart. you are my hero, girl. i'm so sorry that you got hurt. this is all about money and fear. what a brilliant post this is, capturing the best and worst of what happens when people get scared and angry. this is the first post i've read from someone who experienced this firsthand. i'm sure there are more. i'm just not reading much lately. this stuff terrifies me. Care For All is right. i'm in low income housing because my husband's battle with cancer wiped us out completely. this is all about money and fear. love lvoe lvoe and gratitude and pelase come read my post about mental illness parity and rate it, if you can.
Thank you for the report and I'm sorry that you got injured.

What I find really interesting in all of this is that had this been the Bush administration, no one with a dissenting view would have been able to get near the place. Every time someone tried to protest anything Bush, they were whisked away. But not right wingers. They spew and disrupt all they want unfettered and cry foul when called on their bullshit.

They are pro-insurance companies. They want accountants to be able to deny your claims. They want you dead. It's that simple.
hope you did something for the injured knee, Catherine.
rtd for you
I know what a compassionate, strong and amazing woman you are. This is such a great firsthand account of these town meetings. What they are bringing out in people. It's so ironic that you are there to promote the health of ALL and you end up with a bum knee. The thing about all the people that shout...really, do they not realize that raising the volume does not make them more right??? The emotions run high, but "grownups" should be able to talk about their differences without resorting to any kind of violence, verbal or physical. Thanks for your passion and compassion. Great post.
"I'm not a very good pacificist" made me laugh out loud. Thanks for standing up for us all of us while risking limb and joint to do so!
Oy. So sad that so many people are so very very stupid. Hope you heal.
Wow, what an emotionally and physically charged experience for you! I just can't believe it! What is happening to respect, politeness and social etiquette? I'm sorry you got hurt.
I made a simple comment the other day responding to a right wing person, and boy did the right wing flock to me! Our discussion went on and on ....but at least there was no name flinging or hate flinging....just a lot of misunderstanding and fear.
Thank you for posting this and for holding your own at the meeting. It's plain scary that people can be so delusional around this issue.
c berg almost rocked the handcuffs! righteous!
Thanks for this report from the front lines. You said this in a comment on my blog last week; "I'm heading to our Townhall meeting Saturday and hopefully will not have to kick ass."

You actually went, for which you have my admiration. Though you came pretty close to having to kick ass, it's great you didn't actually have to; that kind of thing is best left to Union Thug. Way to go Carol:)
Wow Carol what a situation. Like Dynomyte said though, I fear that no minds will change on this. The good news if the pollsters are right is that WE are in the majority. The bad news is that THEY have the money. I fear it's hopeless Carol.
After my experience yesterday, it is wonderful to hear from so many astute and intelligent people...the people of OS! And it's not just because we agree (although that IS nice), it's because those here have a broader view of the world and the U.S. than just to the end of their noses. I see compassion in the comments, compassion not only for people who are less fortunate, but even for the people who are afraid of a Black President, and a Democratic Congress. Because they are afraid that their pocketbooks will suffer...they already gave up their freedom with the Bush Administration.
http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/53303332.html
I'm proud, you are the woman that was "kicked by a fella" :)
Good for you. I don't know what I would do, but a big man picking on me would cause my pacifist genes to recede and I might have twisted my knee too. I am thinking that in the end, the Democratic majority better act like it and push the bill through because things aren't going to get better until we act like adults and make a decision for those who would rather suffer the status quo than risk change.

I also think that Town Halls are often populated by whack jobs and loud mouths. We have to communicate directly with our elect officials, and email works and are tallied in Congressional offices.
Way to go, C!!! Actually, I think you did ok, pacifistically speaking; like others here, I can't be sure I'd have been as kind as you in the same situation.
I SO applaud you. I also feel that I would have been pretty traumatized by that incident, and I hope you weren't! Too much, anyway!
It's insane that you had to experience fear and be injured at a town hall meeting about HEALTH CARE.
I'm a little blue this evening, but still hopeful that somehow something will change, maybe enough to promote more change....
Thank you for standing up for me with your voice and actions. You are amazing!
(I live in Mass., where we HAVE to have insurance, and some of what'ts happened here has been used as a model for some of the legislation. I may have mentioned this on your blog before. The point being - there were no town meetings around here, probably because our state system is already so different!)
carol, thank you for voicing your words (in writing and in shouting). i feel your frustration (well, it's my own, yet i feel it also). people don't have the SLIGHTest idea how to walk their talk. we're all mocking birds. it's so sad.
by the way, how's your knee?
Sounds like a civil war zone...obviously, there were some human beings in there, though. Rated for casualtied knee! Hope it feels better soon, but I think in general we all be hurting for awhile...
Carol

I just sent you an email about the Grassley event this Friday at the state fair.

Hope you can make it!
A little late catching up, but I hope your knee is feeling better! Just finished having a conversation with a co-worker where she described HUGE mansions in Lincoln, NE she saw this weekend, not to mention gated communities. Who can afford to live in places like that? You guessed it, doctors and the UNL football coach. Care for others - you've got it right!!!
"My former friends the doctors made me angry when they kept yelling at me about how they treated people with no health insurance all the time and didn't charge them. If that were the norm, it would be great, but it's not the norm."
I see this so much. People think that because they are charitable and help people, then EVERYONE else does. This is not so. Because a few doctors are able to give, doesn't mean all can or do. Most people do get stuck.

You are so right that there is a lot of shouting, but not much getting done. Am I crazy to think that corporations love the shouting on both sides, because they can divide and conquer?
I am glad that so many people asked you if you needed help. There are human beings under all this.
You are right about so many things. I think, overall, those meetings aren't constructive except for form's sake, so we can say, "If this were really a dictatorship, then they wouldn't let you show your ___ at a meeting." No one learns.