There have been several posts about torture lately. Most of them are written by well meaning people but I think they think of this in the "not in my back yard" style that they live their lives.
So play along with me and think like a parent for a minute. You have seen the parent on TV that I think most of us are. They are the ones saying "just let my baby go". So get out zone and look into your heart and tell me what you would really do.
I have your daughter. I've held her for the past couple days and I've done all the nasty things your mind can create. The police got lucky and they have me, but I'm not talking. Why should I. When she dies in about 3 days nobody will find her body. I'll walk and there is nothing you can do about it. So what do you do. Sit at home and cry knowing the painful death your daughter is getting ready to go through, letting your mind run wild with what has already happened, or drip water up my nose?
Remember today you have the power, which we never do, but for now you have it. I also hope that you never have a reason to consider this point for real.
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blucey
Deleted Account
Black Boots
snarkychaser
McAuthor
Christine Macdonald
Salon.com
Comments
The problem here is that a ticking time bomb scenario does not exist outside the confines of fiction and cynical political manipulation.
If a suspect is captured and interrogated because the government suspects them of being involved in an imminent terrorist plot, said suspect’s co-conspirators would find out almost immediately of their capture. Someone knowledgeable about a pending attack would undoubtedly have to stay in touch frequently with his or her fellow plotters. As soon as they fail to communicate with their contacts on schedule, their co-conspirators would have to assume that one of theirs has been detained and interrogated. They would then have to assume that their plans are going to come out and would immediately cancel the attack and disperse themselves to the winds.
So how would you answer the question posed? Pour water up my nose, or let your daughter die.
It's easy until it comes in your front door and attacks your family. At that point it's not the "confines of fiction" anymore or some political game.
I'm willing to play along and answer your fictional scenario, but only if you acknowledge that your scenario is completely unrelated to government torture policies.
What we do as a government policy is different than what I would do if you went after my family. When I wrote this there were lots of posts about how there is no way they would ever do it, no way no how. Most looked like a rant that was not thought out when in fact I believe most people who ranted they never would, when it happened to them, would respond like Julie. I know I would hold him down for her.
I don't believe in absolutes. The only absolute is I was born, therefore I will die.
The fact that it didn't work that time doesn't mean it will never work. That is why when the debate was hot I agreed with the position that it needs to be done on the order of the President only.
One person has the responsibility and the same person has the call. It can't be the person who is dealing with the problem and is caught up in the emotions, or just who ever is in charge right them and couldn't give a crap.
I suffer from CRS a lot.
If the police can lie to someone about what they know or don't know or anything else to get a crime solved why shouldn't they be able to lie about using torture?
To really do it, not the police. See my last statement.
let me ask you something sincerely... if reality doesn't matter, why should any of us ever get any rights or due process? your advocating for constructing our laws based off your imagination. why is that a good idea?
if you really had my daughter, who doesn't exist, there's no guarantee that anything the police or i might do to you would get her back.
so you can go to your grave knowing that you had someone tortured for no reason AND you lost your daughter. is that the kind of justice we should strive for? your scenario doesn't reflect reality, and it also doesn't reflect any ideal.
tell you what... i have your daughter. you've got the wrong guy. and i live on mars. you can't arrest me, you can't do anything to me to compel me to come back and i'm not telling you where she is.
what do you do? do you let the person you have go? did you torture him yet or not?
However you missed the point of the scenario. The point is you have to make it personal to see what a person would really do. Like that little girl that was buried alive by that guy a few months ago. If I was her father, I would have poured the water myself.
Liberals like to live in their ideal world that doesn't exist when it knocks on your door.
Report back and let me know what he said.
Several people from the CIA have reported that they had gotten actionable information that has stopped other attacks on American soil.
You would have let those people die. Would that be blood on your hands?