OCTOBER 25, 2009 3:09PM

Do Artists' Kids Need Shoes Too?

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Gertrude Kasebier thought so. In 1897 she was publicly advising women that photography could be a “gratifying and profitable success.

 

 This was new. On all sorts of levels. This was new.

 

The print above, “The Manger” sold for $100. A record.

 

Today Kasebier is viewed as a giant of modern art.

 

At 37, she entered the Pratt Institute of Art and Design. Here’s a portrait she took of her teacher, Arthur Wesley Dow.

 

 Dow by Kasebier

 

 Dow was an ancestor of mine, cited by artists other than Kasebier, as being a major influence on their work. (See Teaching Genius to Paint).

  

Here’s a piece by Kasebier clearly showing Dow’s influence and his stewardship of the Japanese term, “Notan” Very loosely translated as “filling a space with beauty.”

kasebier_dock

 

  

One theme in Kasebier’s enormous body of work was the bond between mother and child.

 h2_33_43_132 

Her own marriage was not a happy one. But like every artist she channeled that into her work. This is called “Yoked and Muzzled—Marriage.”

 

gertrude_kasebier-yoked_and_muzzled

  

In the late 1890’s, “Buffalo Bill’s Wild West” show, a theatrical performance set up shop in Brooklyn; and Kasebier wandered over with her camera. Throughout the next 10 years she’d photograph members of the troupe.

 

Unlike other artists who would focus on the Native American dress or customs; Kasebier zeroed in on her subjects as individual people. Individual people. That too, was new.    joe_black_fox 

Her legacy as an American artist is of course first in her stunning body of work; and the influence she had on those who came later.

 

But there is another legacy woven into the full, rich tapestry she left behind. It’s a footnote to her history. But it’s a reflection of an argument that has been going on since cavemen and women first drew pictures of last night’s dinner on the walls of their caves. It’s a really simple question. Much deeper than it sounds.

 

It’s this: Should artists make money?

 

At one point in her career, a seminal figure of American art, Alfred Stieglitz, called Kasebier, “beyond dispute, the leading artistic portrait photographer of the day.”

 

Few years later, that changed. Kasebier and Stieglitz had what’s described as an “unexpected personality clash.” Now while no one ever has a lens large enough to know what that means in total; one thread of the clash was Kasebier’s belief that it was OK for artists to be commercially and profitably successful. Stieglitz, on the other hand, put forth the idea of “art for arts sake.”

 

Kasebier had that “thing” artists have. That thing where if you don’t do your art, if you don’t pour yourself into it down to the tip toes of your soul; you find yourself not breathing right. Who knows? Maybe she would have done her work for free?

 

An awful lot of people in the business of packaging every kind of art and bringing it to the world know about that “thing,” artists have. They know it can be a vulnerability and they know how to exploit it.

 

But not everyone in the business of bringing some kind of art to the world sees it that way.

 

Some would agree with Gertrude Kasebier. Some who are, today, right now, in the position to make a difference.

 

Like, for example, Rocco Landesman, recently appointed by President Obama as Chairman of the National Endowment for the Arts. Landesman’s belief, which he has demonstrated in his own career, is that the arts can actually be an economic engine.

 

Now, take that core belief, which Mr. Landesman stated in his initial interview with the New York Times; and start dreaming.

 

What if the arts could; Change lives? Give voice to history? Create literature by opening doors to literary talent that would otherwise be closed?

 

What if the arts could  build community among the arts, business and government? Groups of people who don’t talk to each other all that much.

 

And what if, here’s the big one, what if the arts could be a force that wasn’t seen as simply a “nice to have” part of life?

 

What if the arts were NOT seen simply as something business or the government supported?

 

What if we took Gertrude Kasebier’s way of looking at the world  one step further and figured out how to put the arts on equal footing with business and government?

 

A true economic engine. What if the arts could actually stimulate economic growth?

 

In that same New York Times interview, Mr. Landesman had a quote that I’m guessing Gertrude Kasebier  would have liked. Here’s what he said,

 

“Artist’s kids need shoes too.”

  

What do you think?

   

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I agree that the arts are a way of life for some, acknowledged through purchase and endowment. Those who create art live with a passion that borders on psychotic. Artists feed their creative muses, but real life demands one be able to pay for basic necessities. Why is that a few artists succeed with fame and fortune in their lifetime? Too much talent is lost to the ages due to a loss of finance and eventually intent. This is a shame. Until society realizes that the arts are as vital as infrastructure, architecture, military -industrialization and corporate monopolization, we as a people are doomed to dream small. ~R~
What a vision you create here, Chi Guy - as you often do. It reminds me of the question of whether ministers/healers should be paid for their services; some say that these gifts should simply be given, not "sold." But throughout history, there have been patrons, including government, who felt that art was/is an important inspirational tool. And coming from a family of musicians on one side of the family, I must answer YES - artists' kids need, and deserve, shoes. So do the artists.
I was on the phone earlier today with an artist friend of mine who asked why, with all my creativity, art and writing had I not become a millionaire? I had never considered the question (especially put in quite this way) and my initial response was, "Getting up and being creative for me is like breathing. If my ability to express myself through art or writing was suddenly taken away, my existence would have no meaning. I would rather write or paint for 10 hours straight for no money whatsoever than be paid to do something I hate." Thus, whether someone pays for or capitalizes on someone else's talent is the greater question to ponder here. I won't sell pieces of art to people whose energy I don't respond to positively no matter how quickly the check would clear. WHen someone buys a painting, they are taking home a part of me and I have to be willing to let that part of myself leave to go home with them. I loved this post.
I realized after I posted this comment I called you "Gary" as I thought of what Gary Justis woud say about this. Sorry about that, Roger. I need my nap. xoxo
Every time a school system cuts back on art and music as "luxuries" I want to scream. Art in all forms is as indigenous, and necessary, to civilized cultures as food, industry, commerce, education. Unfortunately, it is a more subjective "commodity" and therefore so is its value.

Few artists of any discipline will ever be paid what they're worth, especially in their lifetimes. That should change. But. Well. Teachers (including those in the arts) should be among the highest paid professionals... Keeping pushing for The Right Things, Roger. Please.
Shoes. Definitely shoes. My kids need them and I know all too well the essence of what you are talking about here. They don't call us "starving artists" for nothing.
I have had the same question posed to me as Catouche's friend asked her. Which really bites at the heart of the matter. My answer to that question is: you gotta have what people want, even if they don't know what they want until they see it, hear it, read it, experience it, and you gotta have it when they want it. You have to be in the right place at the right time with the right goods.
That's the Fine arts answer.
Otherwise, learn all the computer graphics and force yourself to swallow a shitload of HTML code and Java script and pretend you understand it better than you actually do and get a job with a company who will believe your BS. Fake it till you make it.
(this usually means giving up on any and all fine arts - no time).
I'm thinking Steglitz's kids, if he had any, didn't have very many pairs of shoes! Maybe he was living off of Goergia O'Keefe's paintings at the time he made that comment. Art has always been a mostly unprofitable enterprise, and without the patronage of European and Asian royalty, we might not know a thing about Leonardo, Michelangelo, and a host of other great artists. It scares me that today's materialistic society has denigrated the role of government in support of the arts, and a lot of other worthwhile endeavors, too. It scares me a lot.
My father put the fear of starving into me early, so I have always tried to find a way to sell my work. It becomes a compromise, you don't do your own work, you do what will sell. I know this better than most, as I spent the first 25 years of my working life as a graphic designer instead of creating what was meaningful to me. I am marginally closer, but still, I feel I fall short since I put my stuff in the marketplace. True vision can't be bought and sold. Art for art sake must continue to exist, and for that, selfless patronage - government or foundation or whatever will undertake the funding - must continue without restriction.
Great Post! I never heard of Gertrude Kasebier thanks for introducing her to me! Yes artists kids need shoes!
And I agree with cartouche that my work is a part of me, so the ones I deem successful in expression I haven't really sold. I 've made art "to match your couch" a short lived if- you -can't -beat- em -join -em enterprise. But I found that even more soul wrenching than graphic design.
Cartouche---being mistaken for Gary is the nicest thing anybody's said to me today!

Whether somebody capitalizes on someone else's talent is EXACTLY the point. Stieglitz wasn't the "bad" guy and Kasebier the "good" one---that's what is so hard about the question.
That and the vulnurability of the artist when they put themselves out there.

Chuck---yes! A balance btw the psychotic and real life. Kind of a tricky tightrope.

Owl--I know a minister who, if he was not a minister, would be the wealthiest guy I know---it's a very similar question.

Sally--in the Chicago schools they are slashing like crazy and there are a lot of us screaming.

Apache--like you said "learn all the computer graphics and force yourself to swallow a shitload of HTML code and Java script and pretend you understand it better than you actually do and get a job with a company who will believe your BS. Fake it till you make it."

That is a LOT of people right there!

Steve---I think that was one reason Georgia eventually took off for the west---alone. . . . But I think Mr. Landesman, who got his start booking the Smothers Brothers in St Louis, might be able to turn that scary tide. He gets it about the shoes.


Ardee-- I bet there a kit of graphic designers who feel the same way.
One of my heroes was Wallace Stevens---brilliant poet AND VP of an Insurance company. I've been trying to figure out how he did that for about 30 years.
Very thoughtful and provocative post, Roger.

The day insurance company CEO's stop making $50,000 an hour, ballplayers don't get $120 million contracts, and Hollywood actors don't get $10 million a film and 2% of the gross may be the day we can pay teachers, policemen, firemen, artists, and writers not named Stephen King or Dan Brown more than a subsistence living.
I have nothing profound to add to this excpet "would that 'twere so."
Being an artist is time consuming, but something you have to do. Now getting money for it is another thing altogether. The only artistic endeavors I found that pays were copywriting, and hairdressing. Pretty limiting. I've sold some paintings, but have to accept that people do not appreciate paying for your time and supplies, much less your artistic vision.

I wish I had an answer, besides YES they do deserve shoes...

R
i think artist's kids definitely need shoes too.

course, just as a writer might not be published and might have to have a "day job" or an inventor might invent things that never catch on, so too will artists have varying levels of financial success.

then of course, there is the "but is it art?" question.

i went to a giant modern art museum this weekend. i dont get modern art, a lot of it. i liked a lot of pieces much more after my friend explained them to me ("yes, those are only strings from the ceiling, but don't they call to mind invisible walls?" and those strings became such vivid invisible walls that i had to put my hand out when i walked through them). on the other hand, much of the work at that infamous sensations show at brooklyn museum, will never be explained to me in a way that makes them art.

artists have a very hard row to hoe, and especially avant garde artists.
Beautiful choice of photos. I am probably one of the few children in this country whose parents encouraged me to study art in college instead of something that would make me money when I graduated. My mom, especially, understands the greater value of art. It has the power to transform societies and becomes a voice for masses of people who no one hears. Wouldn't it be wonderful if, as you said, art became a true economic engine.
I would agree - not only shoes, but health care too! I love the way the artist in you brings art to these pages and educates us at the same time. A fabulous, delightful post.
Here in Indianapolis, we've made a strong case for the arts as an economic engine. The economy has tripped up a lot of public funding, causing a lot of gnashing of teeth and rending of smocks. Meanwhile, we continue to fund stadiums for football teams and basketball teams whose value to our economy is dubious, at best. Perhaps we need to cultivate a culture of arts patronage.
art is the essential human occupation, commerce's greatest contribution is that it makes art possible, sustenance is a common function of every plant and animal organism on the planet, but art is what we get when there's something left over after sustenance is achieved, art is the one human activity that merits the description "godlike", art is what endures of every culture from Cro-Magnon cave painters forward, the only thing held worthy of enduring from most cultures

should artists get paid? the society that denies artists is a society willfully brain-dead

just sayin'
great post and very interesting comments. Melissa/mamoore hit on something that is close to home. Our oldest child had a one man art show as a senior in high school at the Dallas Contemporary...he also scored a perfect 800 on his math SATs, so he has left and right brains. He's a senior with a double major--Plan II (that's a degree in honors, sort of like reading Greats at Oxford) and Studio Arts with a specialty no in film photography.

I never ever considered telling him what to do with left brain abilities...that he should find his way is exactly the way it should be for him.

Artists should be paid, but the art should come first, even given drastic consequences.

Beautiful post Roger, loved it very much.
I loved this post, Roger.
The passion that drives the artist to create is sacred and beautiful, profoundly so. We could never truly repay them for all they give to us, but it would be nice if we actually give them something close to what they deserve - shoes for their children would probably be a nice place to start.
Is it me or does that Indian have a doobie?
Thanks for the wonderful Native American portrait of a relaxed moment. I have never seen anything from their period that wasn't posed and completely self-conscious and stern. I do agree that art needs to be danced, sung, painted and shaped for art's sake, but I don't understand why some are not willing to sell their work, and do not give it away either. Whatever kind of art it is—paintings, pots, stories, poems, or songs—I want mine to have a life beyond me. I want the creations to make their way out in the world, reach others and say something to them. Not always, but sometimes if a price is paid, the art travels farther. I think artists need to be able to express and create and their ability to do this can be greatly inhibited if they are cold and hungry, without money for shoes.
OF COURSE artists should make money. Art is the staff of life. Without the arts life would be so much emptier.
What if the arts could; Change lives? Give voice to history? Create literature by opening doors to literary talent that would otherwise be closed?

Doesn't art already do this? Seriously. The problem, IMHO, is that this doesn't happen frequently enough.

And yes, I agree with Landesman and Kasebier - artists have kids too, and those kids have needs. There is no such thing as "enough beauty" in this world.
You raise some interesting questions, Chi. But are there rules to art? I think not ... at least none that are of lasting value. The rules of art are constantly being broken but artists reinventing art, not just on canvas or in sculpture, but in the written word as well ... how we use them; where we use them, etc. So it would seem to me that there are equally no rules for whether art should be sold or should even sell ... if, where, when, how, even why (because it is in the eye of the beholder) ... it is all a matter of personal desire ... both for the seller and buyer. If anything MIGHT be done beyond that, it might be that we place a greater emphasis in our *education phase* on art appreciation, thus creating (hopefully) more buyers over time, and thereofre greater opportunitty to those artists who do choose to sell. After that, I see the process as market driven.
Barry's already said it for me. In the "show business" of workaday musicianship, I've always tried to make art first and foremost. Some of my peers over the years have mistaken that for prima donna behavior.

When playing with some neighbors, slapping together a couple of sets for the arts council, I've actually been accused of disliking financial rewards for turning down payment, when the truth is that I'd have loved to have been paid handsomely if the quality had been there. The closest I've gotten to "art for art's sake" is posting here at OpenSalon. Real world?
Anne---"art to match your couch" is a great phrase. I might have to steal that somewhere!

Carolina--True. And there is only so much money in any pot. So when it all goes to Stephen King (who I like!) and Dan Brown (who a lot of other people like---their is a systemic problem, a delivery problem. New voices are simply not heard.

AHP---I'm fresh out of "profound" myself so I know the feeling!

Buffy---I don't have the answer either; but your comment prompted the thought that maybe we are all too conditioned to making art being one thing and making money being a whole other thing. Maybe we draw too many lines (if only in our heads) between those two things? Researching this piece, I found a print in the Smithsonian archives (which is the source for these prints) that Kasebier took of Rodin. He was rarely photographed and the print was too dark to post; but I remember the story of him having a factory where he would design "Rodins" and then his apprecentices would finish the jobs and stamp them out. So maybe ther is a way to move the two together and not just accept the fact that artists are always going tobe stepped on.

Jane---that is a really good point. If we think it's tough for artists, how bout artists on the cutting edge? Thomas Pynchon just published a detective novel. I wonder if he could get "Gravity's rainbow " published today?

Roy "willfully brain dead" sums it up well. Killing what lasts.

mamoore--advocating for art as an economic engine is something I've come to believe leaves 98% of the world scratching their heads and saying "Huh? what are you TALKING about?" Which is why it's so important to partner with smart people who "get it." ---when trying to get the message across. I'm fortunate, incredibly fortunate and grateful to have found somebody who "gets it" and knows how to get it across!

Barry---"drastic consequences" is exactly what this requires. Because it's a whole different way of thinking. Support for the arts is so often disguised as patronizing good will. Getting behind that "good will" is required to get to the real issue of the value of art.

Lisa---that's the way I see it. Something that is so simple. We're sure.
Getting there is the tough part!

Harriet--I read that when Kasebier took the shots, she would often remove ceremonial garb so that she could get to the person. There is a subtle (or not subtle) kind of racism she crushed when she took these pictures of PEOPLE--not characters.


Teresa---yes---health care too!

Bill---that's a great comment---"there is no such thing as enough beauty"

Rod--you might have hit on something. If the lack of arts education is so woefully lacking; then the market driven nature of what happens next is also bound to suffer. Perhaps to where it really isn't a complete picture of the market. In other words, if the only thing to buy is Stephen King; is that really market driven? I'm not sure.

Stacey--that's another excellent point no one brought up---artistic behavior getting labelled a prima dona

Is it just me, or are the comments on this post exceptionally insightful, intelligent, thoughtful and more stimulating than the coffee I'm drinking (as I put off applying for jobs and try and reply to all of these great, intelligent comments.)

I think I replied to all of them (someday I'll get a monitor large enough for my old, tired, eyes to see).

Seriously though; the comments on this have been fantastic. If ever there was a post destined for the back, and not the front page, it's this one. I'd put money on that.

But in case anyone else stumbles by by accident---please chime in!
You'd be in great company with all those who have left their extra terrific comments on this.
Can art be both profitable and life affirming? If it was then it would be hard to recruit people to become stock market drones -- that would be a wonderful day.
Wonderful post Roger. Many of the artists who have shunned the commercial potential in their work are wealthy to start with, or they are funded by an individual, or institution. Principles tend to break down with the grumbling of one's stomach.

A good friend of mine in Chicago, a painter, once sold a painting to Nabisco and they used it in an add, plopping a Ritz Cracker in the center of the piece. He took a great deal of flack for it, but after seeing what was at stake for the sale of the painting (his wife was desperately ill, and he was not wealthy or insured)I saw his decision as justified, and held him in high regard. There are many supremely trust, and /or otherwise funded folks in the arts. Many of them work very hard...Many, and they are fine Artists...but many are also quick to look down at other artists who have always faced terrible hardship, creating, and living, by the skin of their teeth, for day-to-day.
Several years ago, I was confronted with a cold truth by some members of a congregation of a church where I was employed as a musician. These folks had the brilliant idea that because mine was a "God-given" talent then I should give it for free. I asked why they didn't approach the ministers with the same proposition and was rebuffed with the "logic" that those folks had gone and studied to become qualified to inhabit the pulpit.

Fortunately, my meager pay of around a hundred dollars a month was not affected then, although that congregation has since decided to stop hiring professionals to lead their choir which has been detrimental to the quality of music they produce.

With the arts, like anything else, you get what you pay for. Unfortunately, too many people think you shouldn't have to pay for art. Come to think of it, probably artist's children don't need shoes. Neither do artists.
Coyote---invoking God to avoid paying you is about as powerful as it gets. Your comeback was excellent. As was what happened---they lost the music.

Gary---good, new point. The judgement put on artists for how they do or don't get paid has an extra layer to it. nobody can judge somebody else's Ritz Cracker!

Dorinda: Can art be both profitable and life affirming?
THAT is the important question!