MUSINGS FROM THE ICONOCLASM!

If I haven't dissed it--it ain't worth dissing!

Frank Apisa

Frank Apisa
Location
Piscataway, New Jersey, USA
Birthday
August 09
Bio
On a political continuum with Extreme Liberal at 1 and Extreme Conservative at 10, I can be found at position “P.” I get a chuckle at much of what passes for liberal thought, but don’t much chuckle at anything conservative. Quite frankly, I consider American conservatism to be one of the most dangerous pieces of garbage ever to pollute the planet Earth. A major problem with this mindset is occasioned by the fact that I am a 72 year old, white male who works at a county golf course in one of the richest, most conservative counties in the United States. Since I get free golf (at five county courses) as part of my compensation package, I play 4 – 5 times a week. Bottom line: Goddam near everyone I work with or play golf with, almost all of whom are 70+ year old white, males, is a die-hard conservative. I love each and every one of ‘em—love every bone in their heads. Truly! Sure is a tough haul, though—‘cause I am not given to holding my tongue. Just think of all the fun I have at work and play! Don’tcha envy me?

Frank Apisa's Links

Salon.com
DECEMBER 17, 2009 10:17AM

Liberals Are On Self-Destruct!

Rate: 4 Flag

   

What the hell is it with you people?

 

Do you folks really want our country to be back in the hands of the Republicans and the destructive American conservatism that dominates that party?

 

What individual have they brought to the national discourse that causes you to want to abet them in what they want to do to the United States…to our rights and privileges…to our moral compass…and to the rest of the world?

 

Was it Spiro Agnew? Ronald Reagan? Dan Quayle? Katherine Harris? George W. Bush? Dick Cheney? Jeb Bush? Sarah Palin? Is it the religious fanatics who dominate their so-called moral agenda and who consider us a Christian nation? Or perhaps it is the commentators on Fox News and conservative talk radio?

 

Who???

 

They call you a bunch of stupid, blind, simplistic-minded stargazers…but can you not conduct yourselves in a way that at least meets that humiliating standard?

 

You trash Obama and everything he does…and you do it at every opportunity. You argue to trash the Health Care Bill because it doesn’t meet your unreasonable expectations; you have issues with the way he is handling the closing of Guantanamo; you bicker with the way he is proceeding in dealing with two wars he inherited; and you savage him for the way he is handling the horrendous economic problems with which we are confronted.

 

Into what dark space have you crammed your heads?

 

Do you not see the inherent danger of your shortsightedness?

 

If you rallied behind this man and the efforts he is making…if you were willing to make the concessions he sees as necessary in the political environment in which we are operating…if you would only stop with “all or nothing” approach…you would be shaking the American conservative movement to its very foundations.

 

Wake the hell up!

 

Look at the mood of the country…and operate as though that has some effect on what can be done and the way it has to be done.

 

Wake the hell up!

 

Those of us who are disgusted with the American right have good reason for that disgust…they deserve all the scorn anyone can heap on them. But for you people to be manufacturing reasons for us to have contempt for your agenda…well, that goes beyond reason.

 

All said, of course, with a smile on my face and love in my heart for everyone here.

 

Wake the hell up!

    

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Right on Frank with one correction--It is not liberals who are losing their minds. It is the "progressives"--you know the wimps who were or are too afraid to call themselves liberals in the first place. They hide behind that word because they couldn't or wouldn't hold their ground and announce loudly and clearly--I am a proud liberal! When the Neo-Cons tried, with success, to turn the word liberal into a negative, they ran and hide behind a cuter word. I have and always will be a proud liberal. I will never be a progressive. There sure are a bunch of folks out there willing to hold Obama's coat while he fights it out. Democratic dolts will whine and in a few years the map will look like it did in 1984 when it was one color--Republican Red--If the Neo Cons take power again they will be empowered and this time they will not fracture like those on the left. They will start locking us up, and millions worldwide will die. They already support the murder of abortion doctors. They support executing gays, where do they think the Uganda crap started? This is a real battle and the left always loses. So good for you, Frank, for speaking up. But they won't listen and the progressives will be the first to scream when our planes start bombing Iran and killing millions. That is where this is all heading. True Liberals need to shout back--let the "progressive movement" babies suck their thumbs in the corner.
There is only one thing wrong with both of your arguments. As far as policy goes, Obama and a good number of Democrats in both houses of Congress are neither liberal nor progressive. They are right-of-center corporatists. Supporting them while they constantly capitulate to conservatives is the same as supporting conservatives.

Happy Holidays!
Harry Truman said Given a democrat that votes like a republican, and a republican who votes like a republican, the American people will vote for the real republican every time.
In Atler's book 100 days about the early FDR presidency, he quotes a conversation FDR had with some more progressive member of the media, saying (paraphrase) Yes, I agree with you. Now get out there and make me do that.
We dont make our politicians do what we need them to do by supporting them with our words and our votes, when they are being kept in office by mega-money corporate conglomerates.
So Frank, THIS is what's with us liberals and progressives. Short of Bernie Sanders, Al Franken, Dennis Kucinich and maybe 2 or 3 others, we dont really have any representation at the federal level. So we are looking for ways to magnify our voices. And if Obama, Emmanuel, Reid et al dont also fear the return of the Tom Delay crowd, then they lose their precious positions. Just like with cancer, sometimes some decent tissue has to be sacrificed to get at the stuff thats really gone bad.
it makes perfect sense to me that liberals and conservatives are acting so much alike these days, because frankly I can't tell the damn difference between them anymore
For me there is no difference between either democrats or republicans. Both pretty much follow the same course. The term liberal or conservative mean nothing to me anymore because one who decides which side of the issue it what in the first place?

I do not feel beholden to follow either side and would rather approach each issue independent of its tag or lable. The country has been in the hands of the same people for the last 60 years. Unless we as Americans are willing to vote outside the predetermined democrat and republican boxes there will be little or no change.
DrSpudman…good points. I’ll think ‘em over. But no matter what you call these people…whether they are well-intentioned or not…it ain’t gonna end up good for our country or the world.

Leeds…I see a huge difference…but I will grant that both parties and both ideologies are prisoners of the money that comes from the people who have money to give. But that is how it always has been in our world.

Tim…keep doing what you think should be done. I think your side is gonna win…which means America loses. We’ll see. I;ve been wrong before.

Same comment to you, Stud. We’ll see where this all leads.

Okay…Mtodd…thank for the comments.
Right on Frank. I think the fortunes of the Democratic party depend on how they treat the outer fringe of the party, the zealots. Most successful organizations disown or downplay those who go too far because they make the whole organization look bad. That has certainly happened with the Republican party. It was particularly telling when McCain quickly lost millions of votes as his campaign ramped up the extremist demagoguery and the nuts on the fringe got more publicity. So it's important foor the Democratic leaders to remain visible and vocal about their positions, to remain the face of the party, and to maintain a calm and sensible dialog about their policies.
Not only do liberals have to wake up...we have to get tougher on the wing nuts on the far right! Nice post.
"Do you folks really want our country to be back in the hands of the Republicans and the destructive American conservatism that dominates that party?"

Oh, I'm sorry. Are we not there already? It's so hard to tell the prostitutes apart anymore; they all smell the same to me. Like money.

Quite frankly, I sometimes think we'd have be better off in the long run if McCain/Palin had been elected. As a Liberal I've half-seriously (and fleetingly) contemplated throwing my support behind the crazy neo-cons in the next election. Because maybe getting precisely what they *think* they want might be the only thing to wake up the lunatics sleepwalking at that end of the spectrum. Like a low-bottom drunk, they'll never open their eyes until everything's in ashes around them and they have nothing left to lose. That goes for the lunatics strung out on Hopium on this end of the spectrum, too.

It has nothing to do with Republican or Democrat. We all - Tea Baggers and Liberals alike - have a common enemy and that enemy is corporatism. Its stench permeates every branch of government. Electing Democrats is the equivalent of spraying Febreze: it masks the smell for a while, but doesn't actually solve the problem. At least with Republicans we might hit bottom a little harder and faster, and it looks like we can't (or won't) start rebuilding till we get there.
I'm willing to give Obama the benefit of the doubt on everything he's done so far, except for selling out the public option. Without a public option, there is no meaningful health care reform.
There is too much fear still in being a self-identified liberal. I SAY GRAB IT! I feel a current change - unfortunately it just hasn't hit congress yet. But it will. Maybe the holidays just make me overly optimistic....oy!