As we approach the midpoint of "Confederate History Month" here in Virginia, the almighty ruckus kicked up by Governor Bob McDonnell's proclamation shows merciful signs of slowing from full-on boil to a gentle simmer.
Unfortunately, the heat has been turned back up a couple of degrees, thanks to a talking point being relentlessly pounded by CNN contributor Roland Martin for the last several days: that Confederates were terrorists, Al-Qaeda in gray uniforms.
"Even if you're a relative of one of the 9/11 hijackers, that man was
an out-and-out terrorist, and nothing you can say will change that," he says in an essay on CNN.com "And if your great-great-great-granddaddy was a Confederate who stood up for outhern ideals, he too was a terrorist. They are the same."
This idea of the Johnny Reb Jihad has found some predictable traction in the blogosphere, and some predictable backlash by people who don't particularly like hearing their great-great-great-granddaddy equated with Joseph Goebbels or Mohammad Atta.
But the whole thing has probably been most exhausting and depressing for those of us who love the study of history in general, and Civil War history in particular.
Over at the excellent Civil War Memory blog, Kevin Levin points out that, despite days of following the story on multiple news channels, there were virtually no professional historians invited to try to bring some context or insight to the audience. "More often than not," he says, the audience was treated to the same talking heads who clearly do not understand the relevant history."
This is not to say that "professional" historians are the only valid gatekeepers in discussions of the past...but they are a damn sight more informative than red-faced, screaming Chris Matthews and Pat Buchanan. I would like to think that if someone had thought to book Simon Schama, or David Blight, or Gary Gallagher, they might have been able to guide us into some deeper waters.
At the risk of throwing a lit match into a damp gasoline tank, I would argue that slavery hasn't been the most important issue in this debate.
Understand, I would never deny, or argue, or in any way marginalize the importance of slavery as the key issue in the secession crisis of 1860-61 and the war that followed. But slavery was the one thing unequivocally settled by the Civil War.
We are dogged today by the things that went unsettled.
We still struggle with the idea of African-American equality, which is related to slavery, but not entirely. Slavery was held in place not just by the law and the lash, but by the attitude, promulgated by nearly 260 years of white rhetoric, that people with black skin were inferior, sub-human, and simplistically happy with their lot in life. Patterns of legal discrimination of free blacks was remarkably consistent over time: when Northern states moved to abolish slavery beginning in the 1770s, most also passed laws that restricted the rights and freedoms of the newly-freed that were only slightly less odious than many of the "Jim Crow" laws of the post-Reconstruction South. Techniques used to marginalize and ghettoize urban African-Americans didn't vary much between Boston or Atlanta and LA, or between 1790 or 1890 or 1990.
Over the last 145 years, particularly in the last few decades, we've managed to shake off a lot of this reflexive racism and right a lot of wrongs, but it's still there, and not all that far under the surface.We have a depressingly long way to go.
(Our experience also begs a much larger question: how does a society evolve out of long-held cultural beliefs? CAN a society evolve out of long-held cultural beliefs? When we wonder why Sunni and Shia Muslims....or Israelis and Arabs....or Koreans and Japanese...or Pakistanis and Indians...don't just put aside their differences and give each other big ole sloppy kisses and join in their regional versions of "Kumbaya," maybe we need to take a look in the mirror and adjust our expectations accordingly.)
We still struggle with the relationship between states' rights and federalism. Our Revolution was predicated on the belief that the local government was better equipped to set and enforce laws for their populations than a King or Parliament sitting 3,000 miles away. Even when we agreed to join in a centrally-controlled representative government, the states retained an ill-defined level of control, thus setting up countless jurisdictional debates long before the Civil War was a glimmer on the horizon. The War showed what would happen should a state choose to secede -- i.e., they'd get the snot kicked out them by the states that disagreed with that choice -- but it did not end the desire of states to test the boundaries of their rights.
Think of it this way: we still talk about state secession, but you almost never hear anyone talk about abolishing the states. Life would be a lot easier for all of us if we had uniform laws, uniform taxes, uniform schools, police and fire departments, and a single bureaucracy to manage it all. Yet, even the most patriotic of Americans generally see themselves in terms of a state or regional affiliation. We are New Englanders, we are Southerners, we are Californians, Alaskans, Utahns, and so forth.
Finally, we struggle with how to deal with the aftermath of civil war. Most countries have witnessed periods of civil strife at one point or another, and if the country survives, it has to somehow come to grips with what happens. Some 800,000 Rwandans were brutally hacked to pieces in the space of weeks in 1993...not by foreign invaders, but by friends, neighbors, schoolmates, colleagues, people they passed in the streets and smiled at while queuing up at the grocery or the movie theater or the soccer match. For there to be a Rwanda after that, without mass retribution, without more violence, without more bloodshed, people have to agree to bring it into a collective consciousness that assigns the minimum amount of blame.
The Civil War was obviously nothing like Rwanda. It was, however, a massive trauma. Over the last 145 years, we've gotten so good at building our collective consciousness that we tend to forget how amazing it is that we came through the 1860s as an intact nation.
At least 625,000 people died as a result the military mobilization. Tens of thousands of others were left with lifelong physical and psychological injuries. The Southern economy was laid waste, both though the destruction of property and infrastructure and the loss of capital embodied in the four million slaves freed by emancipation. Defeated Confederates faced years of humiliating military occupation by Federal authorities. Victorious Yankees were perturbed by the utter lack of Confederate humiliation in the face of their defeat. And millions of freedmen were caught in the middle, hated in their native South, unwanted in the North, given no economic role and very little help in building new lives.
Ex-Confederates quickly built a mythology big enough to let them move forward. Dubbed the "Lost Cause" by a Virginia newspaper editor in 1866, it was durable enough that we've been hearing variations of it for the last ten days. According to the Lost Cause, Southerners had gone to war for a noble cause -- the defense of their states' sovereignty -- only to be defeated by an overwhelming military force. It allowed Southerners to pull from a variety of classical and historical themes to tie their story to everything from the ancient Greeks to the patriot armies of 1776. It was a story told not necessarily to convince the world, really, but to give some form and meaning to their defeat.
While non-Southerners (understandably) never totally accepted this moonlight-and-magnolia version of history, they also didn't necessarily have much interest in totally disavowing it. By not letting the Southern states leave the Union in the 1860s, Americans could hardly turn around after the war and exclude all the South from all civic life. Reconstruction wasn't a benign or easy process, but in the broadest strokes did managed to restore the voting and representational rights of former Confederate states and their citizens with relative speed. Only a couple high-ranking Confederate military officers and political figures were arrested, and none were tried for their rebellion. After Reconstruction, and particularly once veterans on both sides began to grow old, there was more of a willingness to romanticize the War as a fight between two equally honorable sides.
It's easy to sit here, smugly, nearly a century and a half later and say: "Southerners were terrorists who should have been rounded up after the War. We should be like post-war Germany, where Nazi symbols and rhetoric are forbidden by law." Certainly there were people in the late 19th Century who probably would have agreed wholeheartedly (after you explained what "terrorists" and "Nazis" were). But, the reality is, first you have to win the war, then you have to win the peace. Over the very long haul, we won the peace of the Civil War by agreeing on a interpretation that allowed all participants at least a little bit of victory. It was the only way to move forward together.
Historians have, and will continue, to write whole volumes about the Civil War and it's political, social, and cultural aftermaths. Once the Sesquicentennial begins next April -- when every month becomes Confederate History Month -- we'll hopefully be able to push beyond the shouting and the screaming and move into a more fruitful discussion about the legacy of the Civil War, how it can continue to inform our view of what it means to be an American, Northern or Southern, black or white.
With no good conclusion, I'll let YouTube play me off stage. The video below is archival footage from the 75th Anniversary of the Battle of Gettysburg, in 1938. By this point, there were only about 10,000 Civil War veterans still living, most of them well into their 80s and 90s, but at least 1,800 of them traveled, from all over the country, for this last major reunion. President Franklin D. Roosevelt was on hand to dedicate the Eternal Light Peace Memorial. Two veterans, one Union, one Confederate, unveiled the monument. Emblazoned across the front are the words: "Peace Eternal In An Nation United."


Salon.com
Comments
Always fascinated by Civil War history, and you're right, actual historians should get to weigh in on any super-heated discussions.
One of my favorite stories of courage comes from the South.
A company of southern soldiers were put on a hill and told they had to hold it no matter what, or the battle would be lost. For days they help thier spot. Finally all but surrounded as the Union Army came up, the lead officer was told that they were out of ammo. His order? Well boys, let give them The Rebel Yell! So these men, who were down to bayonettes and balls, stated shouting and taunting the Union soldiers.
Take a moment to think about what you think happened.
The Union soldiers broke, and retreated. Next day the Rebs were gone, b/c they held as long as needed.
"CNN is libral (sic), the South is not." Your supporter in fantasy.
So, CNN, founded by Turner, a good ol' boy, and based in Atlanta to this day is not Southern? Represents a California world view? FANTASY, and lies.
As to your words, Heather, LOSS OF CAPITAL! loss of capital, and you wonder why Mr. Martin's words ring so true. Check the mirror, and ask yourself how much capital you represent to whom.
TRAITOR Vice President Alexander Stephens, “….the immediate cause of the late rupture and the present revolution.” He said the United States had been founded on the false belief that all men are created equal. The Confederacy, in contrast, had been “founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the Negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to the superior race, is his natural moral condition.“
Ain't REALITY a bitch. I SAW 2 water fountains as a kid- and I ain't that old yet ... Enslaving people is terrorism, period. You want some "accurate history" check the microfilm on the many, many Northern critiques of slavery by the good people of the time.
In conclusion, and in any time or place, WHAT KIND OF PERSON JUSTIFIES SLAVERY? Again, there were many decent voices, Davis, Stephens and their ilk not among them.
You, dear girl, are an institutionalized racist ... amazing to see a white girl dispute a southern black man on this ... you got some gall.
AUWE
On the other hand, there actually were anarchists in the 19th century, real and imagined.
That would be an interesting discussion
R. Superior work.
News flash: until 1865, African-American slaves were considered property, and could be used by their owners as collateral, as payment for loans, as a source of ready cash, and as a taxable asset. After 1865, slave-owning Southerners who had, before the war, claimed their slaves as assets could no longer do so...thus, they lost capital. There were plans floated by the government in Washington throughout the War that would have paid reparations to former slave-owners as an inducement to rejoin the fold.
NOWHERE in my post do I say that this is a good thing, or a moral thing, or "gee-whiz, it would be great to go back to those days."
Not that I have to present my credentials, here, but just to clarify: I live in Virginia but I am not a Southerner. Actually, I grew up in Vermont, the first state in the Union to prohibit slavery in its constitution. I have no emotional connection to Southern history.
Far more importantly, over the last decade, I have been a contributor to two major encyclopedia on slavery and abolition, as well as several survey chapters on 19th Century social history. You can find some links on the "Publications" page of my website, http://www.heathermichon.com
A
For another example, Robert E. Lee was a Confederate General, while Nathan Bedford Forrest was both a Confederate General AND the founder of a terrorist organization (the KKK.)
It is also possible that some of Sherman's activities meet this definition- assuming we are interested in a historical investigation of terrorism, instead of using it as a way to express our displeasure with the Treason in Defense of Slavery cause.
Perish the thought! You merely say
"At the risk of throwing a lit match into a damp gasoline tank, I would argue that slavery hasn't been the most important issue in this debate. "
Sure. Like Haley Barbour says slavery is just a "nit." Right Heather?
The word "terrorism"applies to the KKK, but not to the Confederate military.
When you consider how the war split families and communities and how people had to make cruelly hard choices ... well, no wonder we are still haunted.
So, "historian", your thoughts on the Confederate Constitution:
Article IV, section 3, clause 3, what is to happen should the Confederacy acquire new territory:
"In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected be Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States."
Yet, you, either through naivete, over-intellectualism, or just plain institutionalized bigotry you pretend there were other reasons. Yes, historian, as you must know there are many, many documents showing the tariff and state's rights issues were worked out, ONLY ONE THING THE CRACKERS COULDN'T LET GO OF --- HATE AND DOMINATION!
Don't even think I'll cool my jets while you make up apologies for your now adopted group of haters- self-haters, actually, WHO JUST CAN'T TAKE THE FACT THAT SOUTHERN CULTURE, FOOD, FAITH, MUSIC, AND WELL, PRETTY MUCH ALL OF IT IS BLACK WEST AFRICAN IN ORIGIN.
That's the facts, and they are hard for haters to take- your cadence: West African; your precious "southern hospitality": West African; your recipes: West African ... a bunch of white skinned losers living under Black African traditions ---- F'ing hilarious.
You dispute this- check those awful- FACTS!
More from my life- my black friend couldn't attend spring break with us in the NINETEEN- NOT EIGHTEEN- SEVENTIES- why? No blacks allowed after dark on Daytona peninsula, during the FORD Presidency- see how your words just ring hollow with the folks who have been beaten over the head by Southern RACIST Hate and apologetic historical revision?
Wake up little girl ... MAMIE'S CALLIN'
Lest we forget it was less than 100 years since these same slave owners decided to toss off the authority of the English king with his taxes and tariffs and become "free." But, of course the slave owners won that time and instead of being known as winning slave owners they became revolutionary freedom fighters.
I grew up in the south and yes there was racism, but not in our home. When my family moved to the north in my teen years to my surprise racism was just as alive and well in the North as in the South. Granted the South may have been more open about their racism, but just because it was sneaker in the North did not mean it was any less racist.
Since I grew up in the south I can appreciate the culture, food, people and history, but part of that history was slavery. If you are going to celebrate the history of the confederacy then face the bad part as well, be honest. Most northerners do not understand, but 90% of the southerners did not own slaves. But, they were dependent on the economics of farming, cotton mills and foreign trade. So to the majority it was rebellion from federal economic oppression. The rich land owners and wealthy needed slaves. Like all wars it is the wealthy and rich who start wars and convince the rest of the population to go along.
I am for strong states rights and less federal government, but in reality we are over 200 years down the road and just because I feel the balance between state and federal powers are out of balance I do not want to see the destruction of the union. And I think the majority don't either they just want to see some restoration of state power that have been lost over the past 50 years.
Who knows maybe things will get so bad in this country that a few states may try and actual rebel. Who knows California may rebel over marijuana rights, that is a classic example of federal powers superseding states rights. If they loose they will be drug rebels. If they win they will be freedom fighters., because the winners get to write the history.
Actually, I have yet to meet a single Northerner who does not understand this. Just because someone is from the North and doesn't support the Confederate cause -- or the Neo-Confederate rewrite of history -- doesn't mean he/she is ignorant of history.
Like the British who found their anti-slavery religion only after the market was glutted (for ex. the former slaver who penned "Amazing Grace"), the war was money greedy for power versus money greedy for power, using any excuse to pit peasants against peasants dressed in the bloody rags of "Glory!" to make more money greedy for power to make more......(well, you get the idea).
Cannon fodder is cannon fodder, but terrorists proactively seek to change the course of history by bestially acting to influence/steer a population through the directed application of fear. Soldiers are relatively innocent of this on the macro level, officers and politicians however, less so!
So, lest the revisionists ever have the last word; the uncivil war had about as much to do with slavery as WMD's did with Desert Scam!
Thanks Heather for speaking simple reason to the indoctrinated. (I really liked the Chou en Lai quote in the comments also).
The South entered into the War as a response to the invasion of their homeland by a foreign force, the North. State’s rights was foremost in the mind of the people of Virginia, Alabama, Georgia, Texas, and the others. The allegiance these people held to the state was equal to what we hold to being an American today. The Confederacy was founded on the preeminence of each state’s autonomy. Victory for the South would not include bringing the northern states into the Confederacy; whereas victory for the North required retaining all of the states as a part of the Union. To contend that slavery was the motivation is a wrong contention. Slavery was an only a insidious institution that was caught up in the maelstrom of the Great Conflict.
However, the viewpoint by the masses, not the extreme right or left, was best voiced by President Lincoln when he said, “My paramount objective in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone, I would also do that.”
As to whether Johnny Reb was a terrorist and a traitor, that is all a matter of perspective. History is written by the victor. Had the Confederacy won the conflict, Johnny Reb would certainly be written in the annals of history as a patriot. In the minds of many, that thinking still prevails. Is it correct? Who am I to say? But, who’s to say he is not?
Your quote needs context, do these from President Lincoln?
"Whenever I hear anyone arguing for slavery I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally." (Speech to 140th Indiana Volunteers, March 17, 1865)
or, earlier:
"I want every man to have the chance - and I believe a black man is entitled to it - in which he can better his condition, when he may look forward and hope to be a hired laborer this year and the next, work for himself afterward, and finally to hire men to work for him. That is the true system." (Speech at New Haven, March 6, 1860)
Your thoughts?
Wasn't the invasion of the Southern Homeland a result of their attempt to secede from the United States of America? So if they had won they would be patriots of the Confederate States of America not the United States of America. Regardless of the intent of those who started and those who fought the Civil War the most clear and enduring issue that it settled was slavery.
I think that with any war, there are multiple reasons that people join. Some are starving and would rather have three hots and a cot than nothing. Are they terrorists? Some are young and romanticize war. Was Sherman not a terrorist, especially considering his policies on Indians? It is often hard for me to see Northerners as morally superior *in general*, as they often have a checkered past of racial strife and prejudice. I don't wish to have a month celebrating Confederates, but I believe that all white Americans would do well to take an honest look at their personal, family, and national history. It would be much harder for them to look down their noses at Southerners if they did.
Confederate Constitution, Article IV, section 3, clause 3,
"In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected be Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States."
Once again, the importance of slavery could not be more clear. Defining "negroes" as an inferior race, and protecting the ownership, transportation, and commerce of "negroes" wasn't just a major aspect of the Confederacy, it was the very definition of the Confederacy.
Quoting legal expert Jack Balkin:
"I am sure that Governor McDonnell of Virginia will want to include careful study of these provisions as part of his celebration of Confederate History Month. Surely we cannot understand why the Confederacy was such a noble and glorious cause worth commemorating without understanding the values and visions of the framers of the Confederate Constitution.
With all due respect- and I do mean all due respect- to Governor McDonnell, the history he wants to commemorate is one of the most heinous ever. It was even worse than so many historical examples where slavery was allowed, because it very specifically designated one race as uniquely and Constitutionally defined as suitable for slavery. If that's the history of his own people that McDonnell wants to remember, so be it. Let's remember it. When people celebrate or commemorate the Confederacy, they not only are celebrating and commemorating treason, they are celebrating and commemorating inhumanity itself. Which defines them, and no one else."
and dems words to the wise ...
AUWE
That's pure bullshit, and the actual words of the people who led the secession prove it: their primary reason for seceeding was to protect their right to own slaves. We have what amount to signed confessions to that effect, by the actual political leaders of the seceding states, made at the BEGINNING of the war, when they couldn't claim duress. Furthermore, the Confederate Constitution contained explicit language prohibiting the abolition of slavery.
Specifically, the States' right to maintain slavery. The Confederate Constitution PROHIBITED states from altering or abolishing slavery within their own borders, even by democratic means. So much for "States' Rights."
When you say that slavery isn't the most important issue in this debate, I understand you to mean in this current debate about whether it is right or not to celebrate Confederate History Month. That's why it surprised me when you followed up with the protestation that you are not dismissing the importance of slavery as an issue of the War. I'm just not clear, then, about whether you mean to suggest that slavery was of secondary importance as a War issue or that slavery is of secondary importance to the Confederate History Month issue. I guess I would disagree with you in either case. As for the first: Slavery was the central issue dictating the federalism argument. Just like today, people then allowed both economics and tribalism to dictate their political views, and slavery embodied both in slam-dunk fashion. As for the second (whether slavery is in the forefront of the Confederate Month issue), I must say I side with Roland Martin: it's inane that Matalin tried to suggest that a celebration of the Confederacy could embrace architecture and food. He's right that the Confederacy, first and foremost, was about preserving a way of life, and that way of life centered on the economic institution of slavery.
I'm not all that sure we're saying different things. I really enjoyed your article.
Food for thought that my graduate history professor from Hiram College (whose postdoctoral work has focused on slavery and abolitionism) posed to us in one of her grad classes: Which came first (in the history of mankind), slavery or racism? She says the arguments about this question rage hotly among historians.
It doesn't matter, really, if people call the South terrorists. It's besides the point. The point is that the Unites States is the only country in history to coddle the menory of a 145-year dead and illegal rebellion against itself. You must ask yourselves why.
I am a Southerner. There are many of us here who deplore, DESPISE slavery and racism. Ideologically lumping anyone together, labeling us, by geography serves no useful purpose.
The quotes you provided are not inconsistent with Lincoln’s quote I gave. The context is Lincoln detested slavery, however, he detested a divided America even more. His greatest concern was the Union, even at the expense of slavery. This mirrors much of the population at that time, who accepted the institution of slavery because of what they saw as the more important principal, sovereignty of the State and/or the US government. The Confederate states saw the sovereignty of the individual states as the overriding principle. The North saw it in the combined strength of the United States. There is no doubt socio-economic conditions fueled both positions.
When in the Constitution of the Confederacy it states that each state has the right to preserve and maintain the institution of slavery as it was added to the Confederacy, this does not necessarily promote slavery. There were Union senators who professed this same view. Admittedly, it was a view of concession which was accepted for the purpose of maintaining unity among the legislative representatives of both northern and southern states. The Constitution of the Confederacy would uphold the right of the state to prohibit slavery, if that state so desired. It was not slavery that was the important issue here it was the right for the states to determine their own course without the influence or interference of a Federal government.
As far as context of my quote for Lincoln. He presented this opinion of his while the Emancipation Proclamation lay fresh on his desk. It was written to Horace Greeley on August 22, 1862. He penned these words to assure Greeley, in no uncertain words, his position on slavery as it related to the Union. The entire passage is as follows:
"I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be "the Union as it was." If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors; and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views."
Like many I am very familiar with your Lincoln quote. It looks like a stretch to lump with the others. Your quote, however:
"When in the Constitution of the Confederacy it states that each state has the right to preserve and maintain the institution of slavery as it was added to the Confederacy, this does not necessarily promote slavery. "
is puzzling ... you put this forth in seriousness?
Let me share with you why I call absolute BS on lying Confederate apologies: I am not a young man, nor a white man, though I can "pass" and this has led me to insights you may not have come across for whatever limited experiences you are summed up as. I am in my 50s and, as a child, met a man born in your "optional" slavery- I touched his more than 100 year old hand, and I felt it. I have spent much time in the South, during Jim Crow ... saw 2 water fountains and, being from here, knew exactly what the message was, even as a street-wise child. I have been hassled to no end in the South ONLY when my whiteness was at issue, I don't have to pass unless I want to, thanks Lena Horne, or, ONLY when I was with Blacks, never any other time. I once had a job in the south, and I like to ball as well as surf, well, I played ball in "boo-town" with the warehouse workers and the next day the boss called me in and chewed me out for, "hanging with those jigs!" I could go on and on and on ... see, I am the sum of my experiences, as you and we all are, and mine are from the trenches of CRACKER TOWN- you live in a dreamworld and your quote is something you ought to defend as it sounds like the biggest crock of apologist twisting in this whole affair so far, and that says a lot, or, is it just a nit, that don't amount to diddly, don't you wish--- what exactly is it you are defending?
?
Thanks for posting this, Heather. You do a far, far better job of reporting it than Roland Martin and CNN. They just don't have the insight.
For Jonathan Wolfman: Do you suppose that 145 years after Jews will still remember the Holocaust? The Civil War was our nations greatest tragedy; our holocaust. The numbers of dead were perhaps less, but there is still the matter of destruction throughout the South and the occupation for years after of Union troops as well. These were our ancestors, North and South; our family histories, if not yours. In Scotland today there are MacDonalds who won't speak to Campbells because of Clan warfare and treacheries centuries ago. You are oerlooking human nature in favor of personal politics, I think. And all rebellions are illegal unless legitimized by victory.
Another point to note (not a justification) is that the United States, whites and western culture invent slavery. Slavery has been practiced by every race including blacks in African, pre-Columbus Native Americans, Asians, Europe and the Middle East throughout history. It has only been considered a barbaric and inhuman practice globally for the last 150-250 years. It was not like the South was operating in a vacuum and slavery was invented by and only practiced by them.
This statement is as false as it is irrelevant to the subject of this thread. Slavery, in nearly all of its forms, has been considered inhuman for MUCH longer than 250 years, even in societies where it was routinely practiced. Slave revolts and abolitionist movements didn't fail for lack of sympathy; they failed because the economies at the time had no alternative place for slaves once they had been freed.
It was not like the South was operating in a vacuum and slavery was invented by and only practiced by them.
Actually, they kinda were: the non-Southern states had already abolished slavery, abolitionist movements were gaining strength both in and out of the US, the British Empire had abolished the slave trade in 1809, and Tsar Alexander II had abolished serfdom (on paper at least) in Russia in 1861. So the South was not operating "in a vacuum," but they were fighting to keep something that was on the way out nearly everywhere else.
Lest we not forget the founders of this nation and the writers of our constitution accepted slavery. I agree many did not and even in the forming of this nation wanted to see slavery ended, and it took almost another 100 years to do it.
The south did not invent slavery and even though the Federal Government used it as a moral reason to go to war, most of the friction was economic and states rights vs. growing federal powers. The rich land owners needed slaves, the north needed tariffs on imports, so the war was just as much about money as slavery.
I am glad that slavery was ended, it is a stain on this nations history. But, I also realize that it was not something unique to the United States or to the white culture. Maybe the invention of mechanize machinery has more to do with ending slavery than our human sense of morality.
From the first kings and chieftains who needed cheap labor to build their walls, cities and pyramids to the plantation owners growing sugar and cotton for the wealthy of Europe, slavery has been an economic justification used by the powerful and rulers of history. I think it has more to do with the nature of people than race.
"most of the friction was economic and states rights vs. growing federal powers. The rich land owners needed slaves, the north needed tariffs on imports, so the war was just as much about money as slavery. "
One who writes like this embodies, quite literally, racism in its institutional form ... candidly, it can be very difficult to be self-aware enough to see it. Especially if that means admitting the truth, that racism permeates 150 years later ... and that the views expressed here all follow the apology path- how to miss?: no 40, no mule; KKK, Jim Crow; water fountains, swimming pools; whites only housing; protests of Civil and Voting Rights Acts; Police brutality: DWB, etc; I mean, it really is hard for a white man, and I am partially caucasoid, it is hard to admit your ilk put down blacks, reds, browns and yellows with legislated and otherwise racist policies- all the documents are there, the apologists ignore those quoted here as if the Framers of the Confederate Constitution in their own words is deniable- it is hard to be white ... boo-hoo-hoo, it's a real bitch.
candy-ass'
Most OT biblical references refer to slaves as indentured or because of debt and once the debt was repaid the person was set free. In the OT slaves also had basic human rights. So those who tried to used the bible as justification for slavery really did not have a justification since the US system of slavery was based on human trafficking for economic reasons not repayment of debt.
As stated before slavery was a blight on this nations history, the act was deplorable and should have never happened. I find it hard to understand how people like Jefferson and Washington so interested in the liberty and freedom of man could justify slavery. Although the civil war was in part over the issue of slavery the major benefit of the war was the end of the atrocity. It did not end racism or oppression of people, but it was the start.
I have no problem with the south celebrating their culture, but ignoring the slavery issue only fans the fires of hatred that still exists. Most southerners I know would rather put the idea of the confederacy rising again to rest and move on in more positive direction. The idea of stronger states rights does not have to include the confederacy which by nature will bring up the issue of slavery. It is counter productive and Virgina's governor is a fool to thing the two can be disconnected. Me thinks the governor had a few to many mint Juleps when thinking this one up.
Your use of the word "accepted" is a bit misleading. Many of the Founders would have been happy to get rid of slavery, but the Southern leaders had made it plain, literally from day one (1776) that they would not support any form of Union that did not allow them to own and trade dark-skinned people like livestock. The Founders "accepted" slavery only because of a large block of states would not allow them to do otherwise and still have a nation.
Don't get me wrong there were leaders in both the south and north that had a moral problem with slavery and fought to change the law.
The important thing is slavery was ended. It would be nice if it did not take a civil war, but it was not a simple case evil south against the righteous north that battled slavery. Both sides were fighting the economics of it. Also, there has always been a strong tension between those who want to maintain state rights verses federal.
Also, the north did not accept blacks with open arms. They discriminated and segregated the black population in the north as did the south. The effects are still being felt in major cities in the north today. I have lived all over this country and found no shortage of racist in both the north and south.
Your comments continue to simply REEK of apologetics. I too have been all over this country, and the rest of the world, living sometimes as a white man, sometimes not. The racism I have seen outside the South, however real and disturbing, well, the idea that it is the "same" as an area where the institution of racism has been, literally in these past days by apologists like yourself and the Mississippi Governor, made to be OK due to the acts of a northerner 150 years ago, is, like your opinions, laughable and based in not just fantasy or apologetics, but something much darker- you hate yourself! Can't stand the truth- that Southern hate is an institution and alive and well and promoted by the governor of the state that brought us Mississippi Burning- 50 years later and he's still the same ... Boss Hog in a hater outfit ... apologizing for hate is a stupid business, you ought to consider opening your eyes and fighting for good.
Haters Suck!
And I do not hate myself and feel I have to justify or apologies for the south. I never nor any of my family (scottish descent) past or present have slaves nor participated in the slave trade. I do not take the blame for slavery because of my race nor do I hold anyone of another race guilty of evil just because of their race. That falls squarely on the shoulders of each individual.
Does your life experience extend at all into the black community?
I am only responsible for my individual acts not what others do or may have done to you who were Scottish. Judging anyone based on ethnic background or geographic location is sort of the bases for racism and bigotry isn't it?
"April 21st marks the seventh anniversary of Nina Simone's death. Hers was a voice that challenged us in so many ways. I have always loved her ironic use of the show tune to call attention to the murders of Medgar Evers in Mississippi and the four little children in Birmingham, Alabama.
'Alabama's gotten me so upset
Tennessee made me lose my rest
And everybody knows about Mississippi Goddamn'
Mississippi and its violence function in the song as common sense; its horrors are known and its failures are deeply felt. And as Nina calls attention to the contradictions and the hypocrisy, as she demands equality for herself and black people, Mississippi stands in for America as such. Her words rest alongside the actions of those young people who dared fifty years ago this month to organize the Student Non-Violent Coordinating Committee (SNCC) and later in April of 1964 found the Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party to challenge the brutality of American racism."
This is truth. Revision is for self-haters. When you apologize you immediately carry water for the former plantation owners who moved quickly to keep poor whites and blacks apart during reconstruction through documented legislation through Jim Crow laws right on up to the Civil and Voting Rights Acts. This is the legacy you've become an apologist for. It is about as believable, and will, in hindsight look comparable to, early apologists of the church who said traditions pre-dating Yeshua were planted by the devil. The difference is, in the case of the former plantation owners- it really was the devils.
Art imitates life- Nina Simone's word over yours? No chance of going with you.
Racism- an American Institution
One of my favorite stories of courage comes from the South.
A company of southern soldiers were put on a hill and told they had to hold it no matter what, or the battle would be lost. For days they help thier spot. Finally all but surrounded as the Union Army came up, the lead officer was told that they were out of ammo. His order? Well boys, let give them The Rebel Yell! So these men, who were down to bayonettes and balls, stated shouting and taunting the Union soldiers.
Take a moment to think about what you think happened.
The Union soldiers broke, and retreated. Next day the Rebs were gone, b/c they held as long as needed.
There was published a collection - complete down to the company level - of all unit reports of combat, Union and Confederate. They make for interesting reading, since many of the officers were barely literate, and all had a motivation for putting the best possible spin on what had happened once the fog of battle descended.
That being the case, I'm sure Mr Thumbs will be happy to give us names and numbers of the company, regiment, brigade, division and army to which these soldiers belonged, and the date upon which the events bragged of occurred.