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Jonathan Wolfman

Jonathan Wolfman
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Maryland, Northwest of The District,
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January 26
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Visit, too, please: www.talkingwriting.com www.doesthismakesense.com www.reortergary.com (pal talk news network)

DECEMBER 29, 2011 6:24AM

Blood to Me: New Religious Attacks on Our School Children

Rate: 38 Flag

 

    

 

     Straight away I must say in fairness that state-church separation issues are blood to me. My dad was General Counsel to the Philadelphia ACLU in the early 1960s, as I wrote here in a tribute to him when he died in August. He and others were instrumental in bringing Shempp v. Abington School Board to trial and on through to a nearly unanimous win at the Court. The Supreme Court declared that while religion has had and may have a respected place in society, the first amendment requires states to be religiously neutral.

     This means that states may not pass laws that promote a  religion in any manner, nor may state agencies, such as schools, require children to be, in effect, a passive, captive audience to the reading of any bible passages including verses from the Protestant King James Version or from the Douay Version, the Catholic Bible. (Other religions' sacred texts were, in fact, simply never used by any school district in daily religious readings, so they are not historically relevant here, and it would be a mistake to think that Jews, for example, consider the King James Bible's first five books a version of the Torah.)

 

 1611 King James Bible- courtesy of Donald Brake  Original King James Bible, 1600s

 

 

 Torah scroll

 

 

Catholic (Douay) Bible 

 

      Know, too, that the Court has ruled that excusing objecting children from religious readings does not answer the constitutional issue, because dismissing a student to the library, to the counseling office, to the principal's office, to the detention room, all serve socially to stigmatize a child for exercising nothing more than her fundamental right not to have to listen to Bible verses in a setting paid for by tax dollars.

      The landmark public school Bible-reading decisions are nearly fifty years gone and their merit has been reaffirmed by increasingly very conservative Courts, from those led by Chief Justices Burger, Rhenquist, and now Roberts. And yet there remains defiance of the Supreme Court in pockets of this country as spelled out yesterday in a comprehensive NYT piece by Erik Eckholm. Here are some highlights, situations that exist today.

          . A Chesterfield County, South Carolina, public Junior High invites a minister to preach at an assembly on September 1. He tells children about his saved-experience and that what every one of them need is "a relationship with Jesus more than anything else."

                   . The same school district sponsors regular, mandatory, prayer rallies. The school principal, a Mr. Stinson, says, "I want these kids to know that their eternal life is real. I don't care what happens to me, but they're going to hear it." He has, in emails, referred to those, even in his community, who oppose his practice as "the dark forces". (Perhaps he ought to have taken up another line of work, or, short of that, he might try out for a summer-stock staging of 'The Exorcist'.)

     The ACLU is working to have this ended.

          . At a Pensacola, Florida school, Pace High, teachers routinely and with administrators' knowledge "cite the Bible as fact" in class as a routine part of the teaching day.

     The ACLU is working to stop this, too.

          . In Santa Rosa, California, one teacher, with a bullhorn, preaches to students daily as they arrive to school.

     The Civil Liberties Union there has worked to end this.

          . Sumner County (Tennessee) public schools welcome the Gideons, the same folks who place Bibles in the bedside drawers at the Super-8, the Motel-6 and the EconoLodge, to distribute the books on campuses.

     Again, the ACLU is involved here as well.

          . In Baltimore County Schools, a principal and teachers have not yet been stopped from regularly leading students in prayer prior to exams.

     The ACLU has threatened suit.               

There are many more instances of school people teaching, in effect, that it is fine to break half a century of settled law as long as one sect of one religion's the beneficiary.

     Let's be clear:  these are hardly noble examples of civil disobedience. You and I know that those who are defying the law in the public schools have no idea who Henry David Thoreau was, have never read his iconic "On Civil Disobedience", nor would they, had they lived in his era, have dreamed of supporting that man's defiance of the tax laws that propped up southern slavery.

     This much is clear, too:

          . a-- Children --all children-- may, right now, pray in public schools. They have always have had that right. They have and ought to have the right to pray to any Being they like. And many do. No Court, nor has the ACLU ever argued against the right of a child to pray quietly or silently to any God for any reason anywhere. But for the lawbreakers, that's just it:  they don't want kids in public schools praying silently to any God; they want kids praying in schools to a particular version of a particular God using particular religious texts and under the direction and authority of the school itself...that is to say, under the authority of government.

         b-- What is illegal is for the state agency, the school, to set aside specific times and places during the routine school day and to oversee religious reading and/or prayer.

To those who truly cannot see the distinction, I have nothing to say other than the law is what it is; you must live with it or mount a proper legal challenge.

To those who can understand the distinction between (a) and (b), above, I'll add this: 

     America is rich in religious heritage and diversity and celebrates both and should. What the movement to undermine the law here wants is to use your money, the taxes of other Protestants, Catholics, Jews, Buddhists, Mormons, atheists and others, to missionize in one incredibly narrow sect of one branch of one of the world's religions. They want to do that as a step toward re-making public curricula in the image of the curricula of the private academies which are run by that one narrow sect. They are not content to try to persuade public school families to have their children attend those religious academies because,

          (1) they know that even their often relatively modest tuitions --compared to secular private schools'-- are beyond the reach of far too many and their scholarship programs are dismal,

and

          (2), they feel a mandate to turn secular, public education into a parochial religious instruction so that the nation itself might be 'saved'.

    As I end this very strange year in America with you, I wanted to highlight one of the oddest aspects of our contemporary legal, educational, and religious culture. And to say how very delighted I am to have been an ACLU member 'forever'. And, finally, again, to salute my dad and his ACLU colleagues for expanding our freedom in 1963.

     This is blood to me but it's also a robust intellectual commitment. At year's end I want to renew my commitment to his and my mother's ideals and say that I am  trying to work hard for Justice --in my support of the ACLU's efforts and in my work with so many thousands of others to broaden the rights of LBGT citizens--  to advance that here and elsewhere, to expand freedom. 

         

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Religious entanglement w public sschools sullies and compromises both. They must be independent of one another for a constitutional democracy to thrive.
"...they don't want kids in public schools praying silently to any God; they want kids praying in schools to a particular version of a particular God using particular religious texts and under the direction and authority of the school itself...that is to say, under the authority of government." This is the crux of the matter right here...
Linn it is; yes, and given that, there simply cannot be neutrality which the Constitution requires. Thank you!
I'm with Linnn. Nice work. / r
People like you discussed, amaze me. The fight for THEIR rights to proselytize while fighting to prevent others from even "being", they decry not being able to force people to read their bible, but will gladly burn the holy book of another religion; they will scream about laws being passed to "persecute" them, but support laws that persecute others.

They are simply hypocrites.
I don't need anyone saving me, nor do I wish for anyone to save my children... They can make their own decisions, thank you. No where does the State, National, or local have any right to make me listen to religious tracks, outside of a literature class....
Religion, by it's nature is a very personal choice, with it's own dogma and beliefs. Let's keep it, to each it's own...
If these people were to get their way who knows where we would be.
The ACLU is obviously a very important organization and I salute your mother, father, and you for supporting it.

Rated/Buddy
Buddy I am the cheapest guy I know but they get my yrly support!
Amy yes, they are. Thank you.
Exclusion is not a right and forced inclusion is not a right. ACLU, your father have IT right. Silent.

I got in a spat with some FB friends over prayer in school and I'm going to forward this on.

We are Americans and that means religious freedom. Freedom from piety? Is that possible. In high school all the games I played at had preachers say a prayer prior to playing. I just don't see that going away.
Sumner County (Tennessee) public schools welcome the Gideons, the same folks who place Bibles in the bedside drawers at the Super-8, the Motel-6 and the EconoLodge, to distribute the books on campuses.

How does that work at state colleges and universities. We have different groups giving out free Bibles all the time. No other texts, just Bibles. Don't know why the others don't proseletyze. (sp.)
Lost my comment! Stupid OS let me type it and THEN asked me to sign in (tho, of course, I already was).

Anyway, I was just going to say that I see by my Google Alerts that some Pagan parent in the south is kicking up a fuss because her kid was given a bible by his school.

I can almost sympathize with the Christian outlook - they just don't GET it - but they need to be forcibly restrained.
Prayers in public places isn't necessarily a horrible practice. It's evidently a big deal for some people and this isn't going away any time soon. Me? I couldn't care less. My children can and do pray in school and the fact that the ACLU has problems with this is disturbing to me. Talk about taking away religious freedoms...
...on the other hand, I respect most of what the ACLU does but when it threatens filing a lawsuit, I'm getting the impression that it is nothing more than an antagonistic attacker intent on pretending it knows what's in the best interests of school-aged children.

The key factor here is choice. We all have choices. Prayer is one of them. I choose to allow my children the benefits of prayer. Whether in school or outside of school, I think we parents should be the party responsible for deciding whether or not prayer being allowed on school campus is good or bad for them or their peers.
Mango pls tell me what they say!
Phyllis I don't know either.
You see, Jon. I am liberal with most issues. To not allow my children to pray in school or any other public facility borders on dictatorial practices.
Myriad I think they know precisely what they're doing and yes they need law to restrain them.
B. as I said, every child may pray and right now in school. It's NOT a choice if the school's running the prayer-program.
I remember my mother having a screaming hillbilly hissy fit exactly three times when I was in school... Once when a teacher dared to strike me, once when the school suspended one of my brothers for something he did not do (and could not have done since he wasn't AT school that day) and once when they sent home with every child a Gideon's Bible. All three took place in the mid 1970's.

The closest my children have gotten to religious education at school was a paper my daughter Mari wrote about the first person (officially) killed in the Revolutionary war. Who, it turns out, was Jewish. (And I can't for the life of me remember his name.)

On the other hand, I am also the mom who has dragged her kids off to religious education classes on *every* major religion... simply because I believe religion is a PERSONAL thing and I do not believe one CAN make a choice about religion in a vacuum.
I understand. It's also not the ACLU's right to decide who may or may not engage in prayers. When it or any other agency intervenes in such personal matters, it should be prepared to understand that by taking away one's options, it is subjected to claims of running the school's programs. I don't want the ACLU or anybody else telling me or my children when or where we can or can't pray. For goodness sake's. We're talking about praying.
Which is why I'll also encourage my children and many others to study WR [world religion] in high school. 'tis good for them to understand and accept others' religious beliefs, rather than deny them knowledge and wisdom.
B. It's the US Constitution and the United States Supreme Court and not the ACLU that decides that children may not be directed to, or told to, pray in public schools.

Since the Constitution cannot defend itself, the ACLU is one of several orgs that try to uphold the Constitution and Supreme Crt decisions.
When I saw the title in my in-box, I thought this might ave covered the recent orthodox harassment of schoolkids in Israel. But your actual post is a fitting subject and you've covered it nicely. Good on the ACLU for confronting these public servants who treat their roles as missionaries.
B. the Court says that children MAY study world religions in public schools. The Court has ALWAYS said that.

What the law says may NOT happen is for a public school to direct children in prayer and to foster one religion over another.

Since only one bible has EVER been used for prayer in public schools (the KJV, shown above), the schools WERE preferring one religion over all others and that is illegal.
Abra thanks my post yesterday addressed the shameful behavior toward girls in Israel by ultraOrthodoz sects. See Judy Mandlebaum's terrific piece here on it on Tesday as well.
It's very prevalent in small towns. In the rural, southern Illinois town that I grew up in, and returned to for a while, the Lord's Prayer was recited by the high school football players on bended knees before each game, there was a religious class based solely on the bible, prayers preceded school assemblies, and there was a manger scene on the court house square. With two daughters, we tackled the issue of the lack of girls' sports programs, but didn't have the energy, or probably the guts, to tackle the religious issues. Kudos to those who do.
@Belinda - the ACLU is not the bogeyman here, though the talking heads love to make them that. They are representing aggrieved parents in those schools whose kids are being forced to pray and forced to learn a religion that is not of their choice.

Jonathan, good post.
jl what do those hs ball teans pray when they lose?
Ardee that's quite right.
Meh. There are no bibles or religious textbooks in my kids' schools and even if there were, there is nothing wrong with reading fiction. Or does this bother you and the ACLU?
Thanks JW. I get awfully behind on posts over the Xmas season.
B. I think I have been quite clear:

1) Bibles as part of world religions classes are legal and oughta be. So would be the Koran, Zen readings, and the Book of Mormon, etc.

2) ANY of those texts as part of school-directed prayer is illegal and those schools and school teachers and administrators using them in that manner are breaking 50-year old settled law and violating the United States Constitution.

I doubt I can make these distinctions more clear.
Speaking of learning world religions in school - this wasn't the intent in my day (I think the intent was simply education), but we learned bible stories AND we learned Greek mythology. Perhaps the bible stuff was presented as The Right Stuff, but I don't remember that. What I do remember was the bible stuff was not nearly as enthralling as the Greek (Pegasus anyone?)

With all due respect, Belinda sounds like those Christians who just don't understand (giving them the benefit of the doubt) why Christian stuff in schools is a problem. Perhaps Belinda is confusing private prayer with public. The schools are paid for and intended for children of all kinds - which in the modern day includes a significant number of non-Christians. Why should their tax dollars go towards support of a religion they don't adhere to? Keeping the schools secular is the only way to go.
Myriad when I learned the Greek gods/goddesses in school none of it was ever taught reverentially, yes.
Here we go with hypothetical scenarios. Stop speculating.
B. I have not been speculating at all.

I have been stating what the law actually says.

It the LAW didn't say what it says, NO org such as the ACLU could EVER be succeffful at ending bible reading in public schools. It is the Supreme Court that says what the law is, not the ACLU.

As I say in the article, if people want the law to say something ELSE, there ARE ways to achieve that. It's called a Constitutional Amendment.

But breaking the law is hardly the way...it is NOT to teach kids how a democracy should work.
What ever became of separation of church and state, freedom of religion and the government keeping its nose out of people's beliefs? I find it disturbing that many of the presidential candidates are so fixated on Christianity and being "God-fearing." Again, it's specific to Christianity. Every child and adult has the right to practice (or not practice) his/her faith.

I'm glad you are keeping your father's memory alive, Jon. So sorry for your loss.
Erica I think you get this very well. Thanks so much.
I think the ACLU should keep their noses out of this one. From every side, this whole thing is about politics. Nothing but politics.
The wingnuts have precious litt

They have limited resources and haveth
Good stuff Jon.
You know it just occurred to me that back in the late 50's and early 60's when I was in elementary school, a daily prayer or daily passages from the Bible were as normal a part of starting school as the Pledge of Allegiance or morning announcements. There were even Gideons once a year or so who would hand out New Testaments on the sidewalks in front of the school.
No one really thought anything of it. (I even recall making a motion in 5th grade class meeting that we restrict ourselves to Old Testament readings in deference to Jewish classmates).
This was normal and we thought nothing of it.
And then it all went away. And then that was normal and we thought nothing of it.
But today it seems different. There seems to be an effort for this to be imposed on children. There seems to be an effort of overt evangelicism that did not exist a half-century ago.
You know, I seem to recall a passage from a Supreme Court decision in the 70's the name of which I can no longer recall that dealt with the display of "adult magazines" in stores. The gist of it was that if adult magazines are displayed in such a way that "unwitting" or "non-consenting" adults were compelled to be exposed to them or if they were prominantly displayed in such a way that minors would be exposed that it constituted the same elements as assault.
I guess my point is that when we were kids we weren't "assaulted" with religion in schools--what there was, was "normative". This effort to "re-introduce" it is, indeed, an assault. And that makes it wrong. More wrong than ever before. We are now less enlightened in spite of all that has gone before us and in spite of all the information and material instantly available on this cursed "web".
Good for the ACLU in its tireless efforts and (hopefully) good for the Courts for even "conservatives" should recognize the proscription of this sort of behavior to be consistent with a "strict constructionist" view of the Constitution.
Anyway...(he says after technical glitch)....,


Get the ACLU out of this fight, it's brier patched sucking up resources they can little afford to waste in 2011 USA.

This whole issue deserves discussion on TMZ and that's it. Let the wingnuts on the right blow their spittle and die a deserving death in the court of public opinion.

No child minds will suffer unduly.

No one mentions the children NOT being affected by this soccer mom slug-athon. People give kids far too little credit to see through all the nonsense.

For them this is just another day in the life in a school that goes on "lock down" when some idiot in 4th period makes " threatening gestures" with a spit wad at the home ec teaher.

Can we finally turn the channel on the perpetual jerry springer show?

RH
Jon,

Excellent article.

What is more enlightening than the examples in your post is the living example of Belinda in the comment thread.

Your main point could not have been more clearly articulated. Yet somehow, and I suspect years of Texas-style propaganda, Belinda not only fails to comprehend the point or to make the obvious distinction that you laid out so unambiguously but even temporarily shuts down (“adios”, “never mind”).

The Constitution, like their religious scripture, is often held sacred by the very same people who then choose to ignore (or vehemently argue against!) very important portions of those same documents. It boggles the mind some times.
Rated.
Walt it feels more assaultive now bc those assaulting have been on the wrong side of the law for 2 generations and they are desparate.

And, in the 50s and early 60s it did feel like an assault to me.
RH I think you confuse the upholding of the Law with holding up chairs on Jerry Springer.
Mark I agree w you as to the Law, entirely.

I'll say, too, that I cherish Belinda as one of my regular readers even when she and I do not see issues in the same ways.
When I went to school everyone had religion classes and it was a Protestant school. It did not mater what religion you were.

Things have changed but in Canada there are two school boards.
Protestant (name has changed) and Catholic. Your child goes to one or the other. You pay your school taxes to one or the other.

There is no religion classes in the Public schools but tons in the Catholic.
My daughter in law teaches religion and literature in a Catholic school board school. She had to change her religion from Anglican to Catholic to be able to teach in that school board.

Little known facts about Canada- no one complains no one cares. Here there would be an uprising.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Canada
Linda that's interesting and, of course Canada's sch syst doesn't have to adhere to the US Constitution whereas our public schools do and a good thing, too.
Prayer to whomever or whatever, is a basic human right and a choice; and should not be imposed on others through the guise of political agendas. It is deeply personal, subjective and has the power to heal that which ails us, if we so believe. It is a practice, privately held, unless we choose to join or exercise our desire to share with others through church or synagogue. It is a gift to ourselves and others when proper respect and lack of judgment is offered freely without expectation, to the prayerful habits of those who so choose it. In one minds eye, prayer is a form of letting go of the ego and material wants that propel us away rom our better selves. Wonderful post, Jon.
Cathy you've written poetry here.
To u, sir, I say: “Did not thy father eat and drink,
and do judgment and justice, and then it was well with him? “
• Bible (King James Version) Jeremiah 22:15

He raised a fine son. The loss of such as him is
Incalculable, especially with all the damn fool idiots around today, eh?

State Religion is what these creepy-crawlies want.
What they want is a Deterministic Universe, ruled by a Mythological JehovahChrist.
So they can feel safe.
Cuz in Reality, they are free, and scared shitless by the seeming chaos enveloping their
Parochial pseudo-paradise.

Mythological determinism. They are no better than their sworn enemies, The Secular Humanists,
Who also believe we are “determined”, but by something different:
Uh, something called “Natural Selection”.
Chemicals and patterns of matter…struggling to survive…

Oh let em fight it out, those 2.

But don’t tread on genius: the u.s. constitution.

Einstein: “Although I am a typical loner in daily life, my consciousness of belonging to the invisible community of those who strive for truth, beauty, and justice has preserved me from feeling isolated.’’


(i have, tho, prayed before certain exams..especially damn chemistry)
James TY I think there are those who do not realize that mandatory bible reading in pub schools amounts to state religion.
As your writing so often inspires mine.
@Linda Seccaspina
"about Canada- no one complains no one cares"
Actually, there has been news lately of a woman wanting to send her children to a public school free of religious teachings. Unfortunately, in Morinville, where she lived, they only offered a school in the Catholic school system. She has been fighting to get a public school in the area. It is a messy situation and by no means fully resolved. There are plenty of folks in Canada, including me, who disagree completely with the concept of having a Catholic school board, or any distinct religious education facility funded by the public. People do care and are making gains toward having a single, publicly funded, non-denominational school board.
Wolfman - Keep it up! In Italy we have the cross in the classes, this since 1929 due to a law agreed to and signed off by a bloody dictator....before that the italian state was a secular one like yours! All efforts by the equivalent of your ACLU has not yet born any fruit (those bureaucrats in Europe ruled against taking the cross off due to the symbol representing "the christian heritage of the continent"!!!!); btw, one hour of religion per week is taught by priests selected by the Vatican and paid by us (the citizens) as prescribed by that shameful concordate!
And we all know how directly and indirectly, the Pope rules us.....and gets our money too!
Saluti and good luck
Danny thanks for this counterpoint.
I live and teach in Santa Rosa Ca. I would never have the gall to preach to my students. I'm hesitant to do relaxation exercises lest they be interpreted as Buddhist meditation. And I was going to say that "this kind of thing would never be allowed here."

I am stunned to find I am wrong. I'm going to find out more.
Ahhh... it was Santa Rosa County Florida. I feel better now. :)
sweet PLEASE share w me what you learn TY
Jonathan, thank you. I think the "Tebow effect" will only make this more prevalent in sports, especially.

On a different, yet similarly themed topic - imagine my surprise in finding out that the ASVAB is administered to all Juniors at my daughter's current school. And then results are discussed with them by a recruiter *at the school.* I'm not even anti-military but I sure as heck don't want them recruiting at the high school. Which sums up my thoughts regarding religion as well - I don't want them recruiting at the school.
@ Belinda T wrote: "The key factor here is choice. We all have choices. Prayer is one of them. I choose to allow my children the benefits of prayer. Whether in school or outside of school, I think we parents should be the party responsible for deciding whether or not prayer being allowed on school campus is good or bad for them or their peers."

Maybe surprisingly, I actual was agreeing with you till the last sentence. YOU do NOT get to decide MY kids need your particular brand of religion. If you want your kids to say a prayer to themselves in every class and twice before each meal knock yourself out toots! Just DO NOT decide that their "peers" need to do it too or should be treated any differently because of YOUR choices.
Amy while I value Belinda as a reader/commenter, I wholly agree w you as to this issue. Thank you.
I think I need to get the section and paragraph of the "law" that bans silent, non disruptive prayer by an individual. I do not believe that it exists, even if it did how could it be enforced? Religion DOES NOT BELONG ON ANY SCHOOL CURRICULUM. Religion is not under the purview of any federal or state law. Theoretically (ask the Rasta Fari). Why do some people see anything short of allowing them to make all the decisions about religion as an attack? I could not care less about a persons personal relationship with whatever deity the choose to believe in. When a particular sect decides it has the right to use their position of influence on children to try and force them to join up with whatever is that educators personal belief then that person should not be allowed to teach in public schools. Then again, I think that parochial or sectarian or whatever the proper term for a religious sponsored school should also have to teach things that are part of the requirements for graduation at a public school.

Sorry, this is a hot button for me, maybe I should go to my own blog and rant there.
Bob I appreciate all you've said here and if you do write on the issue, I'll read it!
Secularisation has always brought improvement to society.
Rated
Heidi in large measure I agree. :)
The ACLU also is fighting efforts in Douglas County, Colorado, to siphon off public funding to give wealthy parents "vouchers" to send their children to expensive, private RELIGIOUS schools. If we could all choose where our tax dollars go, then I would choose to have mine sent to secular, public schools to educate and enlighten our citizenry and prepare them for the increasingly competitive global economy.
Deborah here's the thing re: vouchers:

It's a fraud bc the nation's top voucher is for abt $2700, hardly enough to get any poor family to afford even mediocre private schools.
Before Bush senior declared the 2nd gulf war,he spoke to the nation,stating that God was at the side of the US fighting for justice.
His speech was broadcasted ,I believe,all over the world,and when I heard this ,I found this behaviour absurd.
Heidi of ourse it was absurd :)
I thought our forefathers took care of this.
Matt they did and they'e being actively undermined, of course
"War against Christmas/religion" my ass.
Jonathan, I'd like to express my appreciation for your measured responses to opposing viewpoints here.

I am in complete agreement with everything you've said in this piece and in your comments. I've been a card carrying (really!) member of the ACLU for a long time and really appreciate all the organization does for us.
If I gave all the clashes I have went thru in schools to stop this crap. There would be no more comment room. They just don't get it. They said I was anti-god, even thou I explained I wanted my children raised in MY religion. Who knows, their teacher might be an ex or future cult leader!
Jon, you are an extremely well-mannered gentleman.

@Belinda: "But when you pray, go to your inner room, close the door, and pray to your father in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will repay you."--Matthew 6:6.

School is not a church.
Public education needs to remain secular and neither disparage, nor proselytize any faith. Bible reading wouldn't bother me in a parochial school, but it does bother me at a public school. Full stop.

Children should receive their religious education where they worship and also from their parents'. Full stop.

Don't teachers already have enough to do with teaching the rest of the curriculum?

rated
Great, succinct elucidation of important issues. The failure to really assimilate these ideas is evidence of the 'dumbing down' of our society. It is frustrating that so few religious people grasp that real separation of church and state protects them. A nation whose very foundation was based on rejecting an establishment of official religion now wants to impose one. How ironic is that? More personally, I am sick of the self-pity of Christian fundamentalists who "feel victimized" whenever they are reminded that most Americans don't share their beliefs. They seem to always be looking for some specious excuse to feel put-upon, "oppressed" and "victimized," if only by the reality that their dogma is not universally accepted. BTW, I'm proud to be a card-carrying ACLU member.
Jonathan, I find it kind of funny that you complain about the law breaking of a few in schools but you support the OWS movement and all the laws they are breaking. Both seem like civil disobedience to me.

Why is that?
To all those mainstream Christian parents who are either comfortable with or actively seeking to have organized prayer, religious assemblies, and bible study at their public school:

Your child's teacher is a Scientologist. She gives each child a copy of "Dianetics" and spends part of each day praising the religion. Your child comes home and announces that he wants to be a Scientologist. Are you angry? You bet.

Or: The principal at your public school is an athiest. He organizes an assembly with guest speakers that prove to your child that there is no god. Your child comes home crying.

Or: Your child's football coach is a Muslim. He says each player must study the Koran, and he leads the team in an Islamic prayer before each game.

There could be a hundred other examples. Why can't Christian parents see that rules about religious expression in school are there to protect everyone's beliefs?
uprated - and amen, brother !

i have long thought that a logical path towards putting religion in its place is teaching it as "history".

that is, the comparative study of religions (at the high school level) with examination of the antecedents and similariteis between chistianity, judiaism, and islam. and expand beyond that to hinduism, buddhism, jainism, the greek and roman gods, and so on.

we teach political theory and economic theory in a historical/timeline based context. why not take a similarly dispassionate approach to religion?

if anyone can endure a year semester's worth of comparative religion readings, and come out the other end still believing that their parent's god is the one true god, and every other religion is an abomination . . . well, they must be truly inspired by their god.
What I find truly bothersome is the historical revisionism that so aggressively asserts that America is a "Christian Nation".

I'll cite David Barton of Wallbuilders as one notable example, but there is a whole movement out there that is chipping away at historical truth a little at a time.

Too many Americans are not aware of the European history of Church aligned with State and the resulting tyranny that our nation was founded in reaction against. It was Kings who derived their authority from God and the one true Church.

In America, government derives its authority from We the People, not from an all-powerful divinity. It's bottom up, not top down. The Constitution does not once mention God, Christianity, Jesus, or the Bible. If our founders were trying to create a Christian nation they sure were not very careful about it when they drafted the Constitution.

Why doesn't everyone with a high school education see how wrong this "Christian Nation" lunacy is? I like the suggestion from Baltimore Aureole of teaching comparative religion. Let kids learn about them all, including the anthropology of primitive religions. It should be a lot harder to fall for this notion that any of them possess the "Truth".
When I was little my mother tried to convince me to study at a Catholic school, I was lucky that I had a father that said to me: choose what you want, it`s up to you, so I chose to study at a public school, a decision that I will not regret ever. Now I am making masters in criminal justice and see these things from a totally new perspective, why not let people choose what they want and try not to involve schools in this matter?