Laurel, not Lauren

Laurel, not Lauren
Location
Marin County, California,
Birthday
November 22

Laurel, not Lauren's Links

Salon.com
JANUARY 2, 2009 10:14PM

Lookout INFJs! The INFPs are (dis)organizing!

Rate: 27 Flag

First, a favorite snippet from Philip Roth’s novella, Goodbye, Columbus, about an aimless young man from the Bronx and his ill-fated romance with a Jewish princess from Westchester County:

Neil:  How can I make you understand?  You want to know what my plans are for the future – I’m not planning anything.  Besides, I’m not a planner, I’m a liver.

Brenda:  I’m a pancreas.

Hey, I’m a liver, too (otherwise known as an INFP), and proud of it!  Along with Michael Rogers, odetteroulette, Will Humes, inchkachka, Joat, Black Bart and Paris Pace, among, I suspect, a handful of others here at OS. The heck with you pancreases, I say, here’s to the livers of the world!  Life is too short for balancing checkbooks and organizing sock drawers – we’ve got more important things to put off doing!

(For those of you scratching your heads, INFP is one of several personality types measured by the Meyers-Briggs Personality Indicator, a widely used questionnaire, based on Carl Jung’s theory of psychological types, that categorizes people along four different preference scales:  introvert vs. extrovert, concrete facts vs. intuition, head vs. heart, and organized and orderly vs. flexible and adaptive, better known around our house as sloppy and disorganized)     

As many of you know, Dorinda Fox ran a recent post delving into the notion that INFJs (introverted, intuitive, feeling, orderly types) make up a significant portion of the OS community, a theory that was confirmed by informal tally.  According to the results, INFJs here outnumber INFPs more than 4-to-1, a frightening prospect when you consider the fact that Js, with their organized, methodical approach to the task at hand, are generally far more productive than Ps, who tend to meander their way through life, not to mention cyberspace, a medium that is fatal to anyone with a propensity towards aimless wandering, as any INFP can attest.  How many of us have logged on at 8 a.m. for a quick check of the inbox only to emerge seven or even twelve hours later, with nothing to show for our time but a stiff neck and an ever-expanding library of knowledge on the lives of Lea Lane, Lisa Kern, Greg Thomas, Sandra Miller and all those other over-achieving Js out there.   

Not to single out anyone in particular here.  It’s just that we INFPs are what you might call the slacker cousins of those nose-to-the-grindstone INFJs.  Like our cousins, we’re introverted, intuitive and introspective, but unlike them, we have trouble sorting through the jumble on our desks, let alone the chaos that’s cluttering up our heads.  Day after day, before I’ve even had a chance to finish last week’s dishes and turn a few rough notes into something mildly coherent, my friends on the “J” side of the aisle continue to crank out one meticulously crafted post after another, threatening to bury Ps like myself in an avalanche of productivity.  I’m starting to feel like Lucy at the chocolate factory, devouring short essays like bon-bons as they zoom past on the OS assembly line, and I spend so much time commenting, it may be weeks before I manage to post again.  (And something tells me I’m not the only one around here who’s made a new year’s resolution to establish a more rigorous writing schedule, so I’m guessing matters will only get worse come Monday morning.)

With this in mind, I’m proposing an INFP support group, a kind of forum where INFPs can expound on the virtues of the unplanned life, complain about Js, discuss motor trips (Ps, in my observation, love nothing better than the open road), work out writing strategies or exchange secrets for getting week-old dried egg off a frying pan (my solution:  buy a new pan).  Naturally, we’ll meet when the spirit moves us, at a location yet to be determined.

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OMG Laurel! You might not post much, but when you do!!! Oh, I laughed so hard and long at this one. You have me pegged to the max.
So that's what all that crap means?
By the time I post a comment some of them have another post with video streams and quotes from Churchill and who knows what else.

Those J's. I don't know. Have you noticed that they've already commented on every post you read? Some of the comments are like two pages long! How the Hell do they do it? I type about 125 words in an hour. They do it in a minute.

I'll join the support group, but I can promise you I'll show up late and unprepared.

You rocked with this one!! KUDOS fellow INFP!
Hilarious. Especially the last line.

I tested (recently) as an INFJ. I'm pretty sure that when I took this test last, while still a member of "corporate America," I tested as "potential ax murderer, incapable of team spirit."

I could test tonight and come out as any alpha combo---and since I think your meetings will be a blast---and since, at the pace I'm writing, my next post is easily months away---I'm considering converting to INFP. So please, forward invitations my way.

Happy New Year, girlfriend.
I need to take the test again. Five times was not enough due to the disorganized state my mind was in today. Three weeks off has been too much. Must go back to work.
Oh, this cracked me up! I'm an INFP...ah yes, the clutter. I've wanted to re-take the Myers Briggs for years, hoping that I've become more of an E at least...
The egg caked frying pan!?! Ha ha! I usually buy a new one, but times are getting tough- soak it in baking soda ; )
I need an INFP support group.
I will second what Will Humes sad because I'm tired too!
I've never had much use for the Meyers-Briggs. It seems to deny a basic fact of life. I am a changeling, as are you, and all people except the brain dead. It would be more accurate to say the "I WAS an INFJ at the time I took the test", altho' I may be something quite different by now.

Some of the comments seem to acknowledge this, but I've met far too many people who seems to have bought in to the notion that their personality is cast in stone, and I don't think the M/B terminology of "I am a XXXX" helps.

"I live uptown
I live downtown
I live all around
I had money, and I had none
I had money, and I had none
But I never been so broke
That I couldn't leave town
I'm a Changeling
See me change" The ChangelingThe Doors
I'm domestically unorganized. Doesn't that qualify as having a big toe on the "P" side? Actually us P's and J's should unite against those way too sociable E's. They're the real troublemakers .

You are a funny, funny person, Laurel. Loved this!
What about the lost souls like myself who don't know which group claims my membership? I tend to be rather orderly about sock drawers and checkbooks, yet manage to remain unproductive. Am I in personality purgatory?
Lisa -- you are so nice, I was actually thinking of making you an honorary P even before I posted this. Now it's official. You've got the lackadaisical soul of a P with the organizational skills of a J -- no wonder you're always on the damned cover!

Will -- you're going onto my friends list now, which will bring my preacher count up to three. People who've been through seminary are the most interesting people in the world to me.

Michael -- your posts are a study of P in action, or should I say inaction, which is why I'm so drawn to them. Florida is the perfect environment for a P to flourish -- all that heat and humidity -- another reason why I always feel so at home when I drop by for my virtual margarita.

m.a. h. -- always love having you around, but beware -- too much time around Ps, and you'll be slacking off that gym routine!

Krissi -- Ah, yes, I've seen you hanging out at Mike Rogers' place, so I suspected you were one of us.

Black Bart -- Yes, I know the feeling. But don't retake the test anymore. Embrace your P-ness and know that you are among friends.

Wayne -- I'm all for reinventing oneself (in college, I had more majors than I can count and I've switched careers repeatedly), but once a P, always a P, I fear. A disorganized, meandering disposition is as innate as eye color or an ear for music.
Hmmm...let me think over your comments and organize your main points...so I can highlight the inconsistencies...sometimes I hate being an INFJ. Hey if I slack off a little can I come to the party? I'll wear my liver on my sleeve and keep my pancreas out of site - where it belongs. And if you don't invite me...well.I didn't want to come anyway. :-)
Grif, you would be an improvement to any party. BTW, your summary of the Arab-Israeli conflict is on my To Do list. (And isn't it just like a J to cogently summarize 6,000 years of complex history into a few neat paragraphs?)

Jimmymac, I throw in the towel on your case and am prepared to concede that you are one of a kind.

Paris, I'm negotiating with Michael Rogers about his backyard. Florida is prime P territory, and I'm dying to meet Peggy (a neighbor who figures prominently in his posts) in person.
Laurel,
You would think, with all the time I have right now, that my house would be spotless, (I blame OS, couldn't be my fault) but alas, the P in me rules the roost. I bought a desk the size of a small strip mall to help me stay organized. It has only worsened the cluster f^*k that is my world.
My house is open to all "P's" or any other letters that care to join. Slackers Paradise for sure. Laurel, you would love Peggy. Just don't get in a car with her.
Re: Getting week old egg off a frying pan.

Fill the pan with water; leave in sink for another week. Problem solved.
ME ME ME ME!!! I'M ONE OF THOSE. I don't need to take any silly test! I'd just have to postpone my appointment, anyway.

It is such a relief to hear I am not the only one who quails before the INFJ's. I did not know there was a diagnostic test for them. I just knew them when I saw them! I can no more keep up them than I can fly, or find anything on purpose in Dogpatch. Never mind the flood of beautifully written posts - even the comment production factory flummoxes me completely! They say everything first! And eloquently! I rate and sneak away. Or sometimes I say something really pithy like "great post." It is - has been - mortifying. But if I'm in such good company...

My dogs are looking alarmed because I have been snorting and howling to the point of choking, and they do not consider this amount of levity appropriate. But OMG. This is too too hilarious. You are brilliant. This is fabulous. I will come back to read this again and again when I am feeling inferior.

I'm with Michael, if he can be found. I'll show up unwashed, as well as late and unprepared.
I smell a road trip...or is that the eggs?
As an INT-whatever, I feel compelled to rate this post, just to help all you F types feel better about your handicap.

(Kidding! :-)
Mumbletypeg,
It's good to know that we are not alone and can be proud of our condition. I f you google myers- briggs free test there are numerous sites that allow free testing to find what you already know.
Our first support meeting will be next Tuesday at 8 PM or maybe Wednesday at 9. Nobody knows for sure. I'll CONSIDER cleaning the house in the mean time, but now i need a nap.
I hope you will accept me into the group. I tried to get involved over at Dorinda's but maybe I was a little too random or something. I wound up listed with a question mark.
I am ENFP. Everything you guys are but fun at a party.
May I join?
Michael -- as you know, there's nothing like a looming deadline to get a P moving, so I'm pleased to provide you with an incentive to get out the Tydee Bowl and toss some of those pizza cartons that have been piling up. I'll be there, assuming I ever find my car keys.

Rod -- Ah, yes, the extended soak is a favorite technique of mine. You post so frequently, I could accuse you of being a J, but your mind is far too twisted. I suspect you defy easy categorization.
Tuesday seems a long way off right now. My latest dilemma requires me to replace the belt on my vacuum cleaner. A task of approx. five minutes and the removal and replacement of four screws. The screwdriver and the belt have sat on the counter for over a week and the vacuum pleads for service from the middle of the kitchen floor. I have been tripping over and walking around for the same span of time. The cat hair and dust bunnies aren't going anywhere and OS has stolen my life. Tomorrow is Sunday. A perfect day for Vacuum repair service and bunny removal.
Maybe.
"I could accuse you of being a J, but your mind is far too twisted. I suspect you defy easy categorization."

*Bows deeply.* You honor me, lady.
M-peg -- I'm with you, commenting is an abyss unto itself, not to mention commenting on the comments....aaarrrggghh, it's 11 a.m. and I'm still in my robe

O' Stephanie -- You bring up a good point: a room full of introverts might be about as exciting as a meeting with your tax preparer, so I suppose we could let in a few ENFPs for levity. But you'd better bring along some others (e.g., Natalie B and The Buzz) to keep the conversation flowing.
I just had to come back to this. This post and the resulting comments are hysterical. I'm thinking that people who are professional organizers and housecleaners could make a whole lot of money off of this crew!
Michael, I'll make you a deal: if you fix your vacuum, I will change the burnt out bulb inside my fridge. It's only been about 9 months now. Together we can do this.
If I ever had doubts that I was an INFP before, they are gone now. You've pretty much described me. Oh, every once in a while I get a little burst of organization and productivity, but it passes and then I'm just fumbling along again ;)
Don't do it, Michael! Don't do any of it. Except for the nap.

Laurel - a deadline only provides me with a procrastination schedule. You are absolved from commenting on this comment.
Hey, this is fun! Maybe this post can serve as a sort of permanent floating procrastinator's sounding board and I can stay in the feed forever without every having to write again!

Rob -- somehow I missed you first time through. Must be all the clutter around here...Anyway, thanks for stopping by! Your dapper presence gives the place an aura of respectability.

Joat -- missed you, too! Very cool avatar. What does it mean? Hopefully not something like "next week, I really will do laundry."

Lisa -- aha, you're back -- you can't resist the siren call of P Land! Give in...give in....

quietgirl -- there's safety in numbers, so welcome aboard! Just kick the dogs out of the way.
Ah, That was a nice nap. Stubbed my toe on the vacuum cleaner again. Ouch. Laurel, How many months does it take an INFP to change a light bulb? I don't know either, but I know it's at least nine months!
I'm with you dear, I think Lisa needs to come out of the closet. Denying her true self can't be healthy. Maybe a few gentle nudges will be all it will take.
Hilarious, authentic, delightful piece. Don't forget that the Kiersey label for us INFP's is "The Healer." Sometimes to our own detriment, right? The group? Count me in. Thanks for writing this.
laurel, I must confess my sins that i'm an INFP as well...although perceiving and judging are closely balanced so occasionally, I'm secretly judging as well...

Brenda's line about the pancreas is good though, I have to admit!
If you start using those energy-efficient light bulbs, you don't have to change light bulbs anymore.

But you're not allowed to stop writing, Laurel. We'll wait.
I have a confession. I am only a "J" by the skin of my teeth. My "J" percentage is only (no lie) 1%. I've never really understood what the percentages meant but after hearing others give their percents on Dorinda's INFJ thread, I guess mine is pretty low.

No wonder the laundry pile is as high as my 8-year-old and I only put away an Easter decoration when I decorated for Christmas. This explains so much!
Well, I think you make some very good points. How can I be an INFJ when I am as disorganized as most are organized? I think because I am selectively organized -- my work would reflect an attention to detail that would never appear on my desk or within my projects. Yet, my kitchen cabinets and pantries are super-organized. I think we can only do so much...!
Laurel, your post is what my okie-self would call a hoot! So funny and true. According to the last test I took I am an INFJ, but only by 1%, so I think I can swing both ways. Certainly any propensity toward productivity is limited in scope and of short duration. I can certainly relate to the hours of aimless wandering on OS, and am always game for a road trip. Thanks for this delightful personality profile!
Proud and lonely ESFJ. Was saddened but not surprised to be the only one on V.R.'s list.

Kudos and Rated
Greg
I am an ENFP myself, but I agree we disorganized peeps need a support group....sign me up!!!
I was told to take the M-B in college, in three grad schools, and in seminary. I refused. I told them that just have to have to get over it, but there was a lot of that old gnashing of teeth at the time.

So, you'all have a good time, 'K? When you figure out where youze guys is go'na' meet, don' call me, ye'er?

Great post and lots of fun comments.

Monte
Ah, the catharsis of group confession! Hmmm...24-hour INFP drop-in center? Once I kept a cassoulet simmering on my back burner for more than a month...

Paris -- boy, did your comment ring bells! Car maintenance and the INFP personality profile is a subject unto itself. For weeks I've been planning to do a post about the rats who built a nest under the hood of my Mini, but of course I can't find the pictures I took for the insurance, and pictures are really essential to do justice to this story...Meanwhile, the flat tire monitor light has been on for nearly a month and I've yet to dig out the manual to figure out how to disengage it...And - ha, ha - I do the "shove it away and forget about it" thing, too. For some reason, it's much easier to throw stuff out after it sits around for awhile.

Lisa -- I KNEW it!

Greg -- Brave of you to enter. But beware -- we may be contagious! Now that Lisa has gone P, you may be next!

Coleen -- Yes, ENFPs are most welcome. See comment to O'Stephanie above.

Stephanie K -- yes, an official excuse is always good. It's so liberating to no longer feel compelled to purchase day planners or visit The Container Store. I've come to accept the fact that I am a lost cause.

Rick -- "The Healer" I like that, and it sort of fits in my case. Any other healers out there?

WHOA....I SMELL BURNING CHEESE! Thought those foil covered wedges in the freezer were coffee cake! Failed to label, of course. Must run for now.
Burning cheese? Mmm - that sounds kind of good.

I forgot to say that I looked up Julie on imdb, and between you and one of the user comments, I have decided this is a MUST-SEE movie. If I ever get around to locating it.
anybody still got a Christmas tree up?
Laurel, confession: I am INFP! I am disorganized in every way but writing. Plus, I have ADD, so what does that mean? I actually need an organizer to get my bills paid, etc. I thought my testing was otherwise, but just from my life I know that pans stay in the sink, and such and so I am coming out. If I took the test today, I would probably score as a clear INFP. So I am switching teams until further tests. Isn't that a typical thing for an INFP to do?
Laurel, confession: I am INFP! I am disorganized in every way but writing. Plus, I have ADD, so what does that mean? I actually need an organizer to get my bills paid, etc. I thought my testing was otherwise, but just from my life I know that pans stay in the sink, and such and so I am coming out. If I took the test today, I would probably score as a clear INFP. So I am switching teams until further tests. Isn't that a typical thing for an INFP to do?
The twice posting is a good example. I need to clear out viruses from my computer!
Ha, Lea, this is a revelation! For a "P" you are suspiciously productive! Then again, your life does sound like one long meandering romp, so c'mon in, if you can manage to get past the piles of unread magazines.
Portnoy's Complaint is my biggest inspiration...
Ha, ha, T-Bucket, you're a liver man! I'm partial to organs myself.
Oh me me me! I want to join! I'm a little late to the party, but that's just fittingly characteristic, isn't it.

What a great piece this was. I was delighting at every sentence. (Can one delight "at" something? Or must we only delight "in" things? A "J" would be delighting more properly, I'm sure.)

My P is admittedly on the lighter side -- lighter than my I,N or F, in any case, which are all just about as extreme as they can be. My P is just enough to keep me unproductive. I'm highly organized, but only in short bursts. I adore making lists, but abhor sticking to them.

I also love plans, systems, and charts -- so much so that every year at least I'll dedicate several days towards developing a new, highly organized comprehensive life-plan (with several accompanying charts, of course). I'm always inordinately proud of them, and I will print it all out and tape it up to my fridge or pull it all together neatly in a fresh binder with color-coded tabs, sure that THIS, finally, will be the start of the new me -- but then, inevitably, after one or two weeks I'll get bored and the old me wins again by ignoring the life plan, leaving it to yellow pathetically on the fridge or abandoned on a bookshelf until my next burst of clutter-clearing, when out it goes and in comes the new, enthusiasm unperturbed. And that's a very P thing, isn't it? That as soon as the initial burst of fun and creativity is over, plans become stifling and depressing rather than inspiring or motivating? (Maybe I'm not as light on the P as I think!)

I loved your description of OS like Lucy at the chocolate factory, eating bon bons, btw. Perfect!

Lisa: I had you pegged as an INFP right from the get-go. And where's Jodi? INFP has always been my guess for her, too. I'd be surprised to learn she was anything else. (Although, then again, she is suspiciously productive. Maybe I'll find her over on Dorinda's thread after all?)