Finding Nema - Where Are The Girls in Pixar Films?
Pixar studio burst onto the movie making scene in 1995, releasing the classic Toy Story, the world's first fully computer-animated feature film. It was an instant hit, and changed the face of animated films forever. Since that first movie, Pixar has since released 9 feature-length films:
This realization occurred to me personally when I went to see "Up" this past Saturday (review: A-). The film quickly introduces us to a spunky, adventurous female character, only to dispatch her within the first ten minutes. After that, it's an all-boy adventure (unless you wish to count "Kevin" - the female bird who doesn't speak - as a character).
This is not to say that Pixar doesn't include worthy female characters. But these characters are never the main focus - they're there to support the lead male character in whatever quest he's on. Most often, if you see a female, they're there either as a wife, mother or love interest.
Here's a breakdown of the notable female characters from each film, plus an overall feminist grade on the quality of the female characters:
Toy Story (grade C):
Toy Story 2 (grade B-):
A Bug's Life (grade: N/A):
I have to admit, I only watched this once, and barely, so I won't comment on the quality of the female roles. However, the protagonist of the film is clearly the Dave Foley character, and we're meant to see the action mostly from his perspective. I will give the film credit for having several female actors of note in the IMDB entry.
Monsters, Inc. (grade D):
Finding Nemo (grade B+):
The Incredibles (grade B):
Cars (grade D):
Ratatouille (grade C):
WALL-E (grade B):
- A Bug's Life (1998)
- Toy Story 2 (1999)
- Monsters, Inc. (2001)
- Finding Nemo (2003)
- The Incredibles (2004)
- Cars (2006)
- Ratatouille (2007)
- WALL-E (2008)
- Up (2009)
This realization occurred to me personally when I went to see "Up" this past Saturday (review: A-). The film quickly introduces us to a spunky, adventurous female character, only to dispatch her within the first ten minutes. After that, it's an all-boy adventure (unless you wish to count "Kevin" - the female bird who doesn't speak - as a character).
This is not to say that Pixar doesn't include worthy female characters. But these characters are never the main focus - they're there to support the lead male character in whatever quest he's on. Most often, if you see a female, they're there either as a wife, mother or love interest.
Here's a breakdown of the notable female characters from each film, plus an overall feminist grade on the quality of the female characters:
Toy Story (grade C):- Bo Peep. Classification: Love Interest
- Mrs. Potato Head. Classification: Shrill Wife
Toy Story 2 (grade B-):- Bo Peep. Classification: Love Interest
- Jessie the Yodeling Cowgirl: Love Interest.
A Bug's Life (grade: N/A):
I have to admit, I only watched this once, and barely, so I won't comment on the quality of the female roles. However, the protagonist of the film is clearly the Dave Foley character, and we're meant to see the action mostly from his perspective. I will give the film credit for having several female actors of note in the IMDB entry.
Monsters, Inc. (grade D):
- Boo. Classification: Child in Peril
Finding Nemo (grade B+):- Dory. Classification: Partner
The Incredibles (grade B):
- Elastigirl. Classification: Wife, Mother
- Violet. Classification: Daughter, Petulant Teen
Cars (grade D):
- Sally Carrera. Classification: Love Interest
Ratatouille (grade C):
- Colette. Classification: Love Interest
WALL-E (grade B):
- EVE. Classification: Love Interest, Killing Machine
I can't really fault EVE for not speaking much, since neither does main character WALL-E. EVE at least seems like a formidable robot, judging from the destruction her laser beams did.
In my research for this post, I came across information that Pixar WILL be featuring a female character in a lead role for the film "The Bear and the Bow." Here's the rub though: she's a princess. Granted, from the description, at least at seems like she'll be somewhat feminist - the story involves her desire to be an archer, instead of just lounging around doing princess stuff all day - but ultimately this is still looking like a traditional fairy tale. It's tentatively scheduled for Christmas 2011, so we'll have to wait awhile before we can fully pass judgment one way or the other. However, I must say that I'm a touch apprehensive about the description that it's "Pixar’s first fairy tale." What I've loved about the Pixar films is that they aren't just for kids - there are some very adult themes in their works. I'd hate to have the first Pixar film featuring a female lead to be just another fairy tale.
Lastly, it appears I'm not the first person to notice the lack of female leads in Pixar's stuff: http://www.npr.org/blogs/monkeysee/2009/06/dear_pixar_from_all_the_girls.html
In my research for this post, I came across information that Pixar WILL be featuring a female character in a lead role for the film "The Bear and the Bow." Here's the rub though: she's a princess. Granted, from the description, at least at seems like she'll be somewhat feminist - the story involves her desire to be an archer, instead of just lounging around doing princess stuff all day - but ultimately this is still looking like a traditional fairy tale. It's tentatively scheduled for Christmas 2011, so we'll have to wait awhile before we can fully pass judgment one way or the other. However, I must say that I'm a touch apprehensive about the description that it's "Pixar’s first fairy tale." What I've loved about the Pixar films is that they aren't just for kids - there are some very adult themes in their works. I'd hate to have the first Pixar film featuring a female lead to be just another fairy tale.
Lastly, it appears I'm not the first person to notice the lack of female leads in Pixar's stuff: http://www.npr.org/blogs/monkeysee/2009/06/dear_pixar_from_all_the_girls.html
edited 6/9 @1:08pm - I see that this got Digg.com'd, which is awesome. A few notes, since the comments are blowing up:
1) I don't think Pixar is being intentionally exclusionary, nor do I think this some weird, "Let's keep the wimmen folk down!" Hollywood conspiracy
2) I *heart* Pixar films in general. That's the point of this article. I would love to see the Pixar magic produce a movie that features a girl in the lead, that's all.
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The glaring exception that I can think of is Kim Possible. She's the hero / crime fighter and her goofy sidekick (Ron Stoppable) is a boy. I'm sad that Kim Possible hasn't made more of a dent in the American cartoon psyche.
And alas, the male-centricity continues in elementary and middle school book series: Harry Potter, Percy Jackson, etc. And in Twilight, although Bella is the main character she is the weak female who is put in danger by males and also depends on them for her protection.
It's kind of a chicken and egg thing. Are books and movies merely a reflection of where we're at as a society, or should they be driving our attitudes? Sadly, I suspect that if Pixar put a girl front and center that it wouldn't do as well (note Coraline), but who knows. Also, note that there are some kids' movies such as the Barbie series that are actually decent in quality for young girls, but they're not the type of things that transcend gender (I can't imagine very many boys watching Barbie and the Dancing Princesses).
Two exceptions I can think of are Mulan and Pocahontus. I don't know how they did at the box office, but both were good movies that appealed to boys and girls alike, and that had positive messages for girls.
I'm not sure what the answers are, but as a parent of two girls I've become acutely aware of the lack of female role model characters and concerned about what subliminal effect it will have on them to grow up in a such a male-centric media culture.
i didn't like the incredibles much because i thought the female characters were actually living stereotypes. the mom's ability is... supermulti-tasking! the teenage girl's ability is... disappearing!
and worst of all, the whole villain's plan, which MUST be opposed... is equality? wtf?
http://www.thefword.org.uk/reviews/2005/01/the_incredibles
And damn! I knew nothing of ‘Up’, and I was hoping it might be different. Oh well. Without investigating the whys and hows, I’ve been assuming Pixar’s a boy’s shop, filled with young, talented men who simply create the worlds they come from and are used to. I hope they clue in to this sooner or later...
Great post.
The letter grade just reflects the quality of the female characters' roles. My overall grade for the Pixar films, in terms of how much I enjoyed them, regardless of any gender issues I may have is:
A+:
Toy Story
Toy Story 2
Finding Nemo
A:
Ratatouille
The Incredibles
Up
A-:
Monsters, Inc.
WALL-E
B-:
Cars
A Bug's Life
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/realgirls/
What's sad is that if you start reading up on real folk tales there are a ton of fantastic female characters out there that would make amazing movies.
And our role in history has been erased. For example, did you know that the idea for the cotton gin and at least some of its implementation came from a woman? Or that pioneer women had the right to own property and had a major economic impact through trade of household goods (pre-Walmart)? No? Wonder why this kind off stuff gets omitted from the books but we all know about Clara Barton and Florence Nightengale, in their so-called traditional female roles.
It's because she kicks ass, in her films. She's the boss.
my African-American friend has two bi-racial daughters who want princess toys, but there are none to reflect them! :(
sadly, it makes me love Disney that much less, and it seems Pixar is on the same racist, sexist boat.
Rated.
So, nothing's changed! But then, isn't it obvious that the media is controlled by male Republicans? Just look at the bimbos and ridiculous shows in TV Land. The women are silly, shallow, bleached blonde, boob job golddiggers usually, which is code for : "women are whores". Whether it's commercials, "news shows" (assuming there is really news on any of these shows), or any TV show, women are whores. That's the message of the media, loud and clear.
So, how do we deal with this? Turn off your TV in protest and don't go to the type of movies that feature only male characters...which means, you won't be seeing many movies!!
Halfof42 makes a good point as well.
I think one of the reasons why this is so frustrating is because Pixar does such a great job with their films. We want them to lead the way because we love their movies--but of course they don't. How hard would it have been to make Woody or Buzz or The Incredibles a minority? Nemo could have easily been a girl...
In light of all those things, Nemo's gender really is irrelevant.
I heard something recently that girls will often read or watch something with a lead guy character, but boys (up to a certain age, perhaps?) will not read or watch something with a lead girl character. What's up with that?
If that is true- then why does changing the name to female bother you? She's not suggesting Nema be an able-bodied character or dependent on able-bodied characters.
Heck, change Woody to Wooda or Lightning McQueen to Lightninga McKing, but leave my Nemo alone.
And Eve saved Wall-E, remember?
i thought that was a really fantastic and moving (but very very dark) film. i'm not trying to criticize it. but i think it's interesting that you would describe only the end sequence, as if that makes her a strong female character.
moreover, they're both robots. why are they even gendered at all? in a more literal, symbolic sense, "she" brings life. she's even egg-shaped for crying out loud. she's a super-womb.
unlike mad_typist, i'm not that critical of films where the characters aren't human, but damn... it speaks volumes if the only strong female characters the pixar guys can conjure are robots. my biology is just holding me back i guess, and that's why even if i had superpowers, i'd end up a housewife despite myself!
um, edna's no character: she's a legend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Wintour
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edith_Head
CHAIRS! The little kid's chair wants to be a big chair :“The master wants to throw me away. They’re redecorating!” and the evil baraclounger rules the house and there’s a lovable old couch that’s lost a pillow and Randy Newman will write some crap song - “You can sit on me”.
Even better – Pixar Disney presents --
MISCELLANEOUS APPLIANCES! With Dane Cook as the can- opener. Not the crumby old can-opener – that’s Wally Shawn “OOO I hope this fancy new Can opener doesn’t take my job away!” Or else --
BRUSHES! The adventures of a toothbrush who wants to be a hairbrush! Chris Walken as the wily old paint brush! It’s a world with nothing but brushes in it. There’s more where that came from. Just buy the ticket. We don’t care.
Plus ... no meaningful femae characters.
I've had it.
Few things. First, regarding Monsters Inc., you forgot Shmootsy Poo, Mike's love interest. But she is more of a proof to your point. Second, I am not sure I fully agree with you on The Incredibles. I think besides male middle life crisis it does cover female handling her husband's middle life crisis and also, the whole family against the world thing. Elastigirl is the greatest Pixar female character to me, no disrespect to Dory intended. The woman is amazing and she handles everything that falls on her with grace and confidence.
Yes, the scarcity of female role models is sad. But it is better than 20 years ago. We have the girls from Miyadzaki movies, we have Buffy the vampire slayer, we have Kim Possible, we have Ripley, we have excellent Doctor Who sidekicks who occasionally save the Doctor, we have Bones and Tombraider, who besides having breasts can kick any ass. I know I have delved into grown up territory, but I like funny and strong female characters too. The thing is, besides old stereotypes dying hard, there are economics. When there is a hot guy playing compelling hero, both women and men would watch it. But when there is a hot female lead, more women then men usually come. Hence the number of female leads... But it is getting better on tv, so let's keep the hopes up and keep voting for female leads by going to see them.
Despite some of the complaints here, my wife and I will allow our twin daughters to watch Pixar movies because they simply the most thoughtful and well written stories in theaters today.
@halfof42 - Disney is about to release "The Princess and the Frog", which features an African American princess. It comes out soon - I imagine you can catch the trailer over at the Apple trailers site.
@Adam Miller - yes, Pixar does write some pretty good characters. I think Dory and Elastigirl are particularly well done. This article is more an observation than an angry complaint. In fact, I was completely shocked when it occurred to me the other day, because I love the Pixar films so much I hadn't noticed until now.
@Edgar - good to see you, buddy :) And you really the nail on the head: we're so used to Pixar being ground-breaking in every other aspect of their film-making, that it's just strange to think that they've been fairly conservative in terms of featuring a female lead.
Again, I'm not really complaining, just making an observation. Pixar hasn't let us down yet, so perhaps "The Bear and the Bow" will be as great as the other Pixar films. And then we can all be happy with our first Pixar female lead :)
I think there was an NPR interview when it came out that described this, but I am too lazy to go find it. :)
Rated
I don't think that Japan's views on women are any saner than America's. In the worst animes women are degraded and treated as pieces of flesh to be discarded, usually they are a love interest to the male lead, typically portrayed as absent minded, clueless, etc. the most annoying response I find in recent animes to that kind of portrayal is the hot-headed and abusive female lead. I do not think that a woman who abuses a man for the most slightest reasons is "strong," or "brave," in my opinion it's just stupid, and as stupid as man on woman violence.
This brings us to a paradox. This paradox is Hayao Myazaki. He is a man all unto himself in the anime industry. Where I'd say 90% of the animated material produced in Japan treats females in a way I grade from horrible to mediocre, he on the other hand gives us some of the strongest, smartest, and most remarkable women in any animated movie. His first film with a lead female role, Nausicaa is far different than we expect from a princess. Although she is referred as one, she is an adventurer, and not only that but one that is highly regarded by the village and praised for her strong leadership and bravery. There is early on in the film an airship crash, the very first thing done by the villagers were to supply Nausicaa with her air glider so that she alone can warn the air crew of their inevitable accident if they didn’t change course. This is already vastly different from the typical animated film featuring a princess. Whenever a girl in other animated movies has an idea of sorts, she is bottled up by her father or mother. There is no way that Nausicaa could come from the studio of Disney, and Belle does not count, sorry.
Another film by Myazaki, My Neighbor Totoro was so different to film critic Roger Ebert’s sensibilities that he said it was remarkable that it took a film to come out of Japan to feature two girls as the leads. In the U.S. he claims it would have been about two boys, or a boy and sister. He might be right in that respect, I don’t recall there being an animated Disney film solely about young girls.
There are many other Myazaki films with strong female leads, Princess Monoke, Laputa, Spirited Away, and these were all mega blockbusters in Japan when they were released. I think he has really set the proper tone with what can be done with women in animated movies, and I really wish that other people, especially Pixar would follow his lead. They don’t, and it could either be the result of unimaginative marketing types who claim no one would go watch a film with a female lead, or simple chauvinism that has gone unchecked. Hard to say, my money will be on the boring marketing people.
I guess we'll know we've arrived at Equality Junction when the protagonist of one of these films is a gay female minority.
Rated.
Big thumb.
On the other hand, Fairy Tales are not just for kids. If you really looked at the stories are very adult themed: sex, drugs, crime, etc.
I think the answer lies in the summary of these individual films as having somehow failed individually rather than collectively. That is, let's suppose that 50% of the movies did show women well. But let's say Finding Nemo was not in that set. Then you'd rate all the 50% that did show women well as A+ but the others as lower even though women were overall shown as ok.
The point is that not every movie needs to be a showcase in women, just a statistical number. Not every movie needs to be a showcase in someone disabled, just some. Not every one needs an African or Asian or whatever person in the lead. So individual scores are slightly misleading, and what's really frustrating is not to see that there's an overall score that's low—I think we all agree that in the aggregate it would help to show more balance—but to see a metric that grades it down merely because it did not feature women is tough. It happens to be that all movies suffer somewhat from this. But when I see a movie that is definitely about a woman (like Contact, for example), I don't find myself giving it a B for how it portrays men just because it features a woman. It might get a B from me if I thought the portrayal of a man was poorly done, but that's a different matter. Nemo does not degrade women or show them in stereotype roles. It is simply a story about a male fish.
I think there are other ways to present the information that do not force the overall statistical average to be made an individual property of the movie. I think that's the problem here. Bad choice of a mechanism for expressing the information because it encourages semantically false conclusions based on the data. There's a whole field of research called information visualization which addresses the issue of choosing the right visualization choice for the right purpose so as not to create exactly this kind of contentious implication.
I found your comments very descriptive of this fellow. It's not a place where honesty and integrity seem to count for much.
I'm not a modern feminist -- I'm a Christian. And I see Pixar exhibiting the same sickness's we see in our society. And if you want to see Pixar change or go out of business, work in our world, the real one. Work to create justice, to end murdering kid's whose only crime is that they haven't been born yet. And work to change the internet, to make our computer's safe for kid's.
Oh yeah, that fellow I knew from Pixar. He quit, thinking he was going to make a fortune. And lost his home. Then his wife.
In Monsters, Inc. there is more than 1 female character. Same thing in Finding Nemo. In The Incredibles I'd hardly call Violet 'petulant'. She's shy and awkward but not moody. And Colette is far more than just a love interest.
I think that Pixar is far more racially insensitive than they are to gender.
Colette in Ratatouille was at least a strong woman who seemed really competent in the kitchen. But I still feel like her main purpose in the story was to support Alfredo because she ended up falling in love with him.
I can't really fault Pixar on the race thing. One: most of their films involve non-humans, and I don't know how you imply race in something like a Car or Monster, unless you get into horrible stereotypes. The Incredibles featured FroZone, played by Samuel Jackson, and Up features a Korean kid who has a HUGE role in the movie.
Even so, I think that it's the movies that drive society more... or the movies that create those male-dominated themes rather than society driving the male-dominated themes. Perhaps in the past it was more society driving the themes and the movies being a reflection of society (movies from the 50's and 40's, for example).
I think, even though there still is a lot of sexism in American society, it's not what is driving the constant male-dominated themes of Pixar films and others. I love the films artistic qualities (I'm a graphic designer and multimedia artist), and most do have strong themes and lessons to be learned, but I agree that it's ridiculous how they also portray females in traditional, weak and supporting roles.
Just goes to show where their conscious minds currently are!
WOW! It's so nice to get back to reading posts from intelligent liberals! I've been debating with completely ignorant right wingers on a Facebook poll rating Obama. Why? I don't know, but I got sucked into it and need to get out.
Agreed that the media is controlled by white Republican men.
HEEEEELP!!!
Not gonna delete that comment. Enjoy the stupidity, regular readers. :)
If your kids aren't complaining, neither should you.
June 08, 2009 03:44 PM
"here here!
i didn't like the incredibles much because i thought the female characters were actually living stereotypes. the mom's ability is... supermulti-tasking!"
Multitasking is bad because...?
Also, you forgot to note that Elastigirl has smarts, a good right hook, and surprisingly formidable stretching powers
"the teenage girl's ability is... disappearing!"
Violet also has a cool forcefield that's useful in rescuing people and bowling over bad guys.
"and worst of all, the whole villain's plan, which MUST be opposed... is equality? wtf?"
Syndrome's problem is HOW he wants to become a superhero. He wants to achieve his goal not my improving himself (morally, physically, mentally, etc.), but by killing off all the other superheroes. This is as bad as someone becoming the best golfer by eliminating his competition (e.g., Tiger Woods) instead of simply training harder. Because Syndrome's frankly immoral means, of course, he's going to be the villain who gets his just desserts in the end.
I meant to say "BY improving himself"
"Here's an idea, why don't you ladies be the role models for your girls? How many Disney movies feature males as the protagonist compared to the number of females? Why must everything have such a sexist spin about it? If you want equality, stop making a big deal about inequality. "
Or better yet, start your own animation studio.
Imagine if the women complaining about Pixar's "sexism" actually directed all this energy to creating animated films. You'd generate female animated role models for girls as well as job opportunities.
"I'm not a modern feminist -- I'm a Christian. And I see Pixar exhibiting the same sickness's we see in our society. And if you want to see Pixar change or go out of business, work in our world, the real one. Work to create justice, to end murdering kid's whose only crime is that they haven't been born yet. And work to change the internet, to make our computer's safe for kid's."
This, my friends, is what is wrong with the world today. People wanting the world around them to change rather than do their part to educate their children about their own morals and beliefs. Rather a nanny-state raise my children than impose any sense of personal accountability to myself. This is not an attack on your opinion, as you are entitled to it, but instead of waiting for change to happen to benefit your inherent lack of motivation, why not teach your children how you want them to behave, rather than try to impose your beliefs on my children.
Great post. That is the techie world.
As a father of three, with two rugrats under the age of 3, I have seen (and own) all the Pixar films with the exception of Rataouille. And I vehemently disagree with your opinions of the strength of the female roles in them all.
I don't consider any of the females you mentioned to just be one note characters. Jessie makes a journey to acceptance throughout Toy Story 2. Boo learns to face her fears in order to rescue Mike and Sully in the climax of Monsters Inc. And although I loathe Ellen Degeneres, her characterization of Dory was hysterical and crucial to advancing the plot. In fact, Nemo's father actually faces harsher adversity when he disregards Dory's advice!
If you are going to crucify Pixar for a percieved lack of female role models in their productions, take a long, hard look at the rest of Hollywood and then tell me that Pixar isn't a cut above the rest in that regard.
By the way, this is a wonderful piece of scholarship. Rated. And yes, fellow commenter, Kim Possible rocks.
As you say, they're not doing it on purpose but it's still depressing.
Especially in light of the fact that as a result of the "sexual liberation" of women, our worth is still tied to sex, even if we think that we "control" it more now than we used to. It's still tied to sex. We're our most powerful when we are sexual. Not our brains, not anything else. Just sex. That's why Angelina Jolie is a "strong woman" - she's sexy.
That is why 12 year old girls are giving oral sex to boys in Junior High; that is why teenage pregnancy and STDs are still a problem.
It's nice to teach kids about sex in a healthy way and not treat it as "dirty" or anything. But they should also be taught RESPECT for it and respect for themselves, because, trust me, if the girls think that they are getting respect from the boys because they "give it up" real easy and that they are "Sexually liberated", they have been deluded very badly.
The rest of this is directed at Soap Box Amy and her post at 4:47 pm, in case she's reading any further posts, or to anyone else that might agree with some of what she said:
The Media is NOT controlled by REPUBLICAN MEN. They are controlled by LIBERAL men who, as I just said above, just love it that women are EASY. However, this does not lead to RESPECT. The old fashioned ideas still stands - men still think women who give it up easy are SLUTS. Period. They probably always will.
The LIBERAL men in Hollywood are the ones that make women up to be nothing more than sexual objects.
You want further proof: the recent Playboy article regarding a "HateF**k" list of conservative women. An article that was rating which conservative women were worthy of basically being raped because at least they are hot. Playboy is hardly a bastion of conservatism.
And AOL has fired someone and forbidden any mention of the article.
And have you actually heard about it on the news? Probably not.
Are you enraged by it? I hope so. A woman's political views should not mean that they are denigrated because of it, especially by an act of rape. To think otherwise betrays everything the feminist movement is supposed to be about. ALL women, regardless of political party, race, age, creed, ethnicity, etc. are EQUAL to men in the eyes of the law and EQUAL to each other. To think otherwise is disgusting.
Remember Bill Clinton? Not exactly a conservative and not exactly respectful of women either.
My basic point being that political party is not necessarily an arbiter of whether someone respects women or not, although I have found that conservative men more often respect women than liberal men do, although many men can be "pigs" in the sense of treating women as sexual objects.
All I'm saying is, how about discussing the issue without creating straw men to bolster your argument.
Movies could use better female role models, for sure. I think conservative and liberal women could agree on that one.
One last time: sexual liberation is not necessarily the best thing that happened to women in the last 40 years. Sure, we got to be "easy" without having to hide it, but what respect have we really gotten because of it? Really dig deep on this one and think about it.
Let's face it, even an easy man that sleeps around is eventually looked down upon as nothing more than a sex object and gigolo.
How is that respect?
If we want that respect, we have to start pushing against the "sexual object" campaign that still goes on. We have to stop thinking that the sexual liberation did anything all that great for us. A little maybe, but not much.
And "My Neighbor Totoro" centered around two completely ordinary middle-class sisters.
Conservative men are the ones who think women should be forced to be in traditional roles, so how can that be called "respect"?
How would YOU like it if most male characters constantly were being portrayed as abusers or rapers or criminals? I'm sure you'd have a problem with it, too.
Nice straw man. "Conservatives", eh? Name me one. Does Todd Palin want Sarah Palin to be in a traditional role? Is she in a traditional role? How about any other number of conservative women who hold office or high level jobs?
Conservatives may generally believe, more often than liberals do, that children are better taken care of by family members, usually the mother, than put in daycare. So what?
I don't see anyone making laws that say women can't go to work. They are merely expressing an opinion, which I believe, is still legal under the 1st amendment.
I have hung around both liberals and conservatives. What liberals tell me is that I can't make it in this world as a woman without help from the gov't, without special privileges.
What conservatives tell me is that I can do and be whatever I want, whenever I want, and I don't need anything but my own brain, my own ambition, my own gumption, to do it.
Most of the conservatives I hang out with don't see women as sex objects, or even baby machines. They see them as they should - as individuals, not as a political group entitled to special rights.
I see no one has bothered to address the Playboy article either.
Once you have, you can explain to me how Conservatives don't respect women and Liberals do.
If a writer, or an artist, wants to do a work without women, surely that's their decision.
But then I'm an old male chauvinist pig, and proud of it.
Krystyna Calloway: It's time to give up the airplane glue.
Yes those conservatives like Schafly and Bryant really want women to run around in bike shorts and bra-less tank tops and be in positions to manage men and also exercise control over their bodies...
Now how about one on Disney TV, which has been dominated by programming for girls for years. Programs like "Kim Possible", where the girl is the superhero and the males are uniformly idiots or evil. I can imaging your review of a Pixar film where the protagonist's female sidekick is a completely useless comic relief dingbat who often loses her pants. Reverse the sexes and you have KP. Another program where boys are the second sex is their animated program "W.i.t.c.h.".
I'm a conservative man and I admit that I've forced my wife to become a senior engineering manager.
Go buy Kim Possible, you'll love it. Then try "Charlie's Angels" 1 and 2, where 120 lbs girls beat up 200 lb men. Or "King Arthur" where the queen also beats up large men, or maybe "Dark Angel" or "Buffy" or the old "Avengers" episodes or the new "Avengers" movie or " X men" 1,2,3 or " Catwoman", or . . .. I could go on and on and on.
"Weak and unimportant" women are hardly the rule, characters like that are the exception. OTOH, if you happen to like "weak and unimportant" men characters, then check out the chick flicks. There's at least one of those in over half of them.
I was married to a conservative (notice I said "was"), and I know many others. Most think that women should obey the man. That's been MY experience.
I don't have a comment about the Playboy article. Playboy is what it is... about sex. So, what else is their to say about it? I could come back and ask you why many conservatives think that children SHOULD NOT have proper sex education in school to teach them how to take care of themselves and SHOULD NOT use birth control (something that Sarah Palin believes, despite the fact that her daughter didn't listen to her).
Pixar (now, but not always Disney owned) makes great quality films. (I agree that Cars may be an exception, but we had the voice of Paul Newman to compensate for what was missing elsewhere.) I am grateful to see ANYTHING of quality geared towards kids, so it pains me to be critical at all.
I must defend, however, Elastigirl--who certainly needs no outsider's help--and absolutely rules the Incredibles. She saves her bored, ego-driven husband from the mess he's made--tempted by the desire to regain his youthful glory, allowing himself to be seduced. Elastigirl is the real hero of the movie-- super or not--saving her whole family from her husbands transgressions. Both Elastigirl (yes!, multi-tasking!--what of it?) and Edna Mode (a business role model who those in the fashion industry may recognize as a combination of the extraordinary Edith Head, and Anna Wintour) there is enormous strength. Daughter Violet gives girls (and boys, actually) a peak at how one can emerge from "hiding" during the awkward young teenage years and blossom with confidence.
Unfortunately, not all of the industries that cater to the kid market concern themselves with quality at all. The subsequent flurry of film-related marketing can be a nightmare for any parent trying to avoid a fast-food experience, in addition to the relentless deluge of television commercials encouraging kids to ask their parents for the latest movie tie-in. This is all part of the movie business--the video games, action figures, cereal boxes, must-have collectibles--contribute to the film's bottom line through multi-licensing deals.
As a feminist, of course I'd like to see stronger female role models. More importantly, I want kids to have access to role models of any gender who possess and exhibit a sense of dignity, integrity and courage. When kids find their voices and know that someone is listening, it doesn't matter if they are boys or girls. Most younger children are not engaged by adults to think and share their ideas. They are shown images of all kinds, not always the quality of Pixar, with no follow-up discussion. There is a trend now in cartoons, on tv as well as in movies, where the theme is "World Domination". (I wonder where that got started?) If there is no communication between adult and child after viewing several hours of this stuff, the result will be crazy aggressive kids v those with through-the roof levels of anxiety and a boon to the kiddy-pharma industry.
In a world where action toys are primarily geared toward boys, girls are left to comb the rainbow colored hair of their little ponies, and decision-making entertainment executives are still mostly men, Pixar's dedication to quality is about as good as we can get for now.
Thanks Pixar, but try a little harder.
ps: For anyone who hasn't checked out Miyazaki, please do.
The quality of the images as art equal the imaginative tales.
Sheer beauty.
I realize that my commentary isn't as clear as it should be re: The Incredibles. The females in that are certainly strong role models and convey important messages to young girls, so perhaps I should have rated that higher.
My point about the lead character is that that character gets a special role in the film. They're the one the audience is most asked to identify with, they're the one who ultimately power the plot (for the most part). This is not to say that there can't be other characters who play important roles or affect the main plot.
As you say, Elastigirl has a huge role to play, and is arguably the hero of the piece. But it's still Bob's middle life crisis that we are first asked to identify with, and it's his decisions that ultimately drive the main plot forward.
All of this is again just an observation, because it just felt weird that this really innovative company was so conservative in picking their lead characters.
This poster does a better job summing up the real issue here: "Still, making something that is inherently genderless male because male=neutral is bullshit.*"
"He wants to achieve his goal not my improving himself (morally, physically, mentally, etc.), but by killing off all the other superheroes."
yes, i agree the killing part is evil, but listen to what his character says. his plan is to make a machine that would make everyone super. he says, "When everyone's super, no one will be." he even wants to sell his super robots to regular folks, and i'm supposed to hate him for it?
that's idiotic. think about our second amendment for a second, and that's exactly what it was supposed to accomplish: equality through technology. politically, this movie is a retelling of harrison bergeron, but i'm still doomed to averageness at the end.
seriously, think about what you're saying. can you train yourself to fly in a gym?? the whole narrative of "be the best you you can be without cheating!" falls flat when some characters have super powers.
and especially when they want to corner the market on super powers, so they'll continue to be needed by us sheep.
listen, multitasking isn't bad. being a mom isn't bad. but when you make super-stereotypes, they're still stereotypes. how would the story have been inferior if dad was the super-multitasker and violet had superspeed? why does mom accept her fate while dad yearns for adventure? why did they make the choices they did?
i thought the fact that "the government" was forcing the superheroes to retire was really telling. why would i be angry about that, but not angry about the fact that the superheroes forced a super inventor to retire, because i might get the chance to fly and shoot lasers too?
why should we address a playboy article in a thread about children's films?
is that what you like to read to your kids at night?
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