Mary Wollstonecraft

Sexism Hurts Men, Women, and Children

Mary Wollstonecraft

Mary Wollstonecraft
Birthday
July 07
Bio
Mary Wollstonecraft is a group blog. Anyone can become a contributor. We welcome posts on feminism, sexism, misogyny, nonsexist childrearing, misandry, male-bashing. Email redstockinggrandma45@gmail.com or PM me to ask for login and password. If you prefer, ask me to post it. Mary Joan Koch/aka Redstocking Grandma http://open.salon.com/blog/mary_king

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OCTOBER 19, 2009 11:18AM

Nikki Stern Interview

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Nikki Stern blogs at It's Always Something. In her profile she describes herself as "writer, editor and first-time book author (Because I Say So: The Dangerous Appeal of Moral Authority comes out next spring); always up for a little discourse

Tell me something about yourself--age, sex, where you live, where you grew up, any siblings, any children?               I was born in 1949, which makes me (yikes!) sixty. I’m female, I live outside of Princeton and have for seventeen years, I grew up outside Milwaukee, Wisconsin, I have a younger sister who lives nearby to whom I have always been incredibly close (insert picture) and an older brother living in Rhode Island.

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 What jobs have you had? Please include all caregiving.        I worked (or rather struggled) in music as a composer and sometimes lyricist before going into public relations. I worked for fifteen years for three different corporate architecture firms (firms of more than 75 people involved with design primarily for corporate and institutional clients). I was a part of the marketing department but head of public relations for the first and third clients and worked as a consultant for the second client. After my husband was killed on 9/11, I worked as a privately funded consultant and families’ representative to the office of the Governor of New Jersey, then became executive director of a national families’ group. I left to focus on writing and to get some time to myself. I hope to go back to work at least part-time when the book I’ve just finished comes out (later this year)

 What was happening with women when you were a girl and teen?                                                                                        My mom was a smart, strong and stunning woman.

 

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 My dad, also a very strong type, was obviously quite taken with her. She was working once I got into high school as a partner with my father, who insisted he couldn’t find anyone smarter to hire, and my uncle in the chemical company they started; she trained the sales force.

 My father may have been a bit more interested in my brother’s future (first-born son and all) but he was close with all of his children and I developed respect for critical thinking from him. dadHe wanted and expected us to go to college and beyond; he never said anything about “getting an MRS. Degree.”

  I had as role models my grandfather’s sisters, who were absolutely amazing individuals. fourladiesGreat-aunt Esther, who never married, traveled through the Northwest Territories at the beginning of the twentieth century and was rumored to have had an affair with the poet Robert Service. Great-aunt Beatrice was a painter; Gertrude was very active in local politics.

  I was very interested in becoming a musician and focused on role models like singer-songwriters Laura Nero, Carol King, Carly Simon, Joan Baez, Emmy Lou Harris, Joannie Mitchell, and Judy Collins.

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  I was aware that women as I saw them on television didn’t seem like those women. I didn’t want to be Mary Tyler Moore or any of the moms on the sitcoms.

 When I was in high school, the significant activity was the founding of NOW which I saw as having a great deal of lobbying clout when it came to issues of pay and education inequality in later years (i.e. Title IX). I was really impressed with NOW

 When did you first notice sexism, whether directed at you or anyone else? Men can experience sexism just as much as woman.                                                                                       I think when I got out of college, because the temp jobs available to me were receptionist/secretary types of things. I also felt there might have been some covert discrimination going on when I applied for a government job. I worked in a few political campaigns; the men always seemed to be in the leadership positions, i.e. those relating to strategy. That ticked me off.  Same held true with other movements of the time, although I was pretty far from being someone who would express herself within a “radical” movement like SDS anyway. (picture of me as teen) Still, although I thought there was more than a little hypocrisy in how women were treated (more like sex toys than as leaders), I didn’t feel that bra-burning made a helpful political statement and I also felt that the significant gender issues had to do with domestic abuse and pay inequality.

 Would your mother consider herself a feminist? Have you ever discussed the question with her?                                   My mother has passed away but yes, she probably would, as would her mother...

 If you identify yourself a feminist, when did you accept that?                                                                                           I have always eschewed labels so I probably didn’t ever come to a point where I “accepted” it. However, as I have become more interested in world affairs, I have become more engaged in organizations and issues relating to the treatment of women around the world.

 What does feminism mean to you?                                        What it means now is that women need to be seen around the world as much more than property or second-class citizens. They should be accorded the same rights as men and they must be free to make their own decisions. I’m particularly anxious that women have access to education and freedom from fear of physical abuse.

 Do you think boys are more constrained by sexual stereotypes than girls?                                                           I think itheoretically they might be. They also receive mixed signals from the media about how boys are supposed to act and how girls want to be treated.

 Do you think men need a masculist movement? Have you ever been involved with the men's rights movement?                                                                               I suppose it wouldn’t hurt, especially given the different communications styles men and women favor. There are custody issues and other domestic issues at play. But honestly, if you look at the world-wide picture, it’s less an issue than bringing women to be on a par with men.

 Is the idea of "feminism" at odds with the idea of "masculism"? If so how?                                                     While I think a men’s movement might assist men in certain social contexts, I still feel there are very concrete issues having to do with equal pay, with latent sexism in the media, with domestic abuse, which overwhelmingly (although not exclusively) affects women and with poverty worldwide, which overwhelmingly affects women and children. There are cultures in which women are so far from getting any sort of equity that I’m inclined to focus on those situations.  

 Are you an egalitarian rather than a feminist or masculist?                                                                        Probably so, but with an awareness that women in other countries and cultures still have a long way to go.

Do we live in a postfeminist era?                                       Which country or culture are we talking about? If we’re talking about Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia, most clearly not.

 How much sexism and misogyny did you perceive in the 2008 primaries and elections?                                             More than I would have liked, almost all of it exclusively perpetrated by certain (not all but certain) members of the media.

 Are OS men too nervous to post on sexism and feminism? What can we do about that?                                                       I have no idea. They might be confused as to what the women mean by that term.

 If you have a partner or spouse, are they concerned with equality issues? How does that affect your day-to-day lives? Do you share housework and child care (if you have kids, obviously)?                                                                     My late husband was a terrific partner. He just didn’t have any issues as to housework and divisions of chores – everyone did what he or she was best at doing.  Furthermore, of his several bosses at work, his best – the ones who paid attention to his work and rewarded it – were women.

 What books shaped your ideas about women?                       I  think my ideas about women were shaped more by my parents than by any particular books. I thought my dad was a great role model. He started a business and hired my mom as art director because he couldn’t imagine anyone smarter or more creative. He encouraged his daughters to go to grad school and do what they wanted to do.

 Who is your favorite woman novelist? Do you think she is a feminist?                                                                                    I don’t have one author who is a favorite. Most of the books I read are by female authors, though there are exceptions – I’ve read everything by Kurt Vonnegut and everything by mystery writer John McDonald. I’ve noticed male writers are offering up strong heroines these days but they don’t seem as “real” Let’s see: Susan Isaacs, Alice Hoffman, Alice Munro, Tony Morrison (anything she writes), Joyce Carol Oates, Marsha Muller, Anne Perry; but perhaps the writer I find most stunning is Margaret Atwood - The Handmaiden’s Daughter could probably be considered a “feminist” read...

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Comments

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wow - seeing those pictures...Great job, Mary!
Great interview about one of my favorite OS writers.
Great interview, fascinating person. Well done, both of you.
You're doing a great thing here. I am interview shy but love reading others. And I am an open book here, through my accumulative posts. Great job with Nikki's!
I love the pictures. Cathy how can you be interview shy when you can provide the questions if you want or just answer my questions that appeal to you? I am delighted my subjects are a range of ages. Nikki is only four years younger than I am, so her interview had particular interest.
I love this -- I'm so glad to hear someone say that feminism in a global issue. It's so tiring to hear people talk of "post-feminism" or go on about whether there is sexism anymore, when all you have to do is look around the world at rape, oppression, disenfranchisement, all kinds of violence -- I think we can interest younger women in these causes by insisting they not be insular, insist at looking at the big picture and how much work needs to be done. And how men's lives, and people's lives in general, will improve with the lot of women.
You clearly had some wonderful female (and male) role models, Nikki. I am so glad that you did not take them for granted.
I think I need to write a periodic post on recommended authors. As a librarian, all the great books mentioned warms my heart.
Fantastic interview and I love the pics.
Mary did a great job...I supplied the pictures. I can't believe I was honest about my age (ouch) but Mary inspires honesty. And damn if I didn't have a great family (all gone now, which is a post for another day)

@ Cathy - you can do it!
@Kathy and Sheepdog - back atcha!
@Emma - I appreciate them more than ever
@Alice and Gwendolyn (gorgeous name) - many thanks
Fantastic interview and thank you to both Nikki and Mary for providing this!