Mauricio Betancourt

I write when I dream the stories

Mauricio Betancourt

Mauricio Betancourt
Cali, Colombia
February 06
Colombian journalist (37). Gay advocator and social worker. I like people and believe people like me. I am as honest and transparent as I can be and like to meet people around the world. I´ve been away from OS for a while but I intent to keep writing and reading of course as it is the only thing that really awakes my heart... Hugs from Colombia and much love

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SEPTEMBER 28, 2010 4:02PM

Could It BE The Muslim Integration?

Rate: 9 Flag

Mauricio BAs a journalist I have to be signed up in all the online newsletters I can get from the most well known Newspapers, Magazines, Tv Channels, Radio Stations, Blogs, Websites and all sort of media out there to keep up with the world. That is why I signed up to Forbes Magazine Online´s newsletter. They have great information and great bloggers installments and today I´ve decied to review some of these installments for OSers to know about. They are very enlightening and somewhat promiscuous between right and wrong. Delicious to read, to digest.

                Today´s topic for Forbes´ blogger  Abigail R. Esman was Islam, Muslims. I read it and found it somewhat, arsonist and powerful. She surfs her installment through the Muslims´ traditions and aspirations in the world. I liked her point of view that is why I had to discuss it with a friend of mine who lives in Canada and here´s what he told me about the subject:

(not edited. Taken from skype´s chat window)

[10:40:20 a.m.] Rob: I just find them, like any religious zealots, a bit out of control
[10:40:32 a.m.] Rob: and expecting a society to bend to their needs is a bit much to ask
[10:40:41 a.m.] Rob: especially when they are a minority

                Here´s something interesting. They are a minority all right. But they seem to be everywhere according to this 2009 report on Islamic Population in the World  yes, they don´t reach the figure to be scary but they do have the nerve of zillions. That for me is scary enough to want them to cool off and think about some other ways to aproach the world and it´s needs and requirements for globalization.

muslimwomanbathingsuitI´m sure American women are not going to be comfortable if their husbands decide to become muslims and start commanding the use of Burqas that have been banned in France and are not very appealing for women.

MuslimsI´m also sure that in this part of the world a woman who´s been seen with a man different from her husband will not be stoned to death just because God says she did wrong and I am 100 percent sure we won´t tolerate our children to be told to call Jews "pigs who deserve to die"   (I recommend you to watch the video)  Then again. It is all just my point of view on the subject. A point of view of a third world inhabitant who does not believe in any Religion, but embraces the Universe as our only Superior Entity for we all belong and are part of only one natural source.

Rob and I continue the discussions and he kept on briefing me on his point of view:

[10:41:04 a.m.] Rob: I'm fine with them practising their religion at home, but don't interfere with my daily life
[10:41:26 a.m.] Rob: I wouldn't do that to them why should they expect me to do that for them

[10:42:10 a.m.] Rob: If your religious beliefs are at odds with the country you're immigrating to, then why are you going to that country?
[10:42:35 a.m.] Rob: arrogance
[10:42:42 a.m.] Rob: pure and simple

                    Arrogance pure and simple. Are these, so called "zealots", really arrogant in their believes? Are these people who seem to deny the world and its social, culture, sexual, medical, ethical, and religious evolution really arrogant towards what we all believe in, though, our freedom is sometimes an illusion?

  Muslim women stare at a girl in skimpy dressWhat is right and what is wrong about Islam and Muslims? Why in a world like this one and in times like these, people profundly religious keep on believing in such things that cut them off the rest of the world? Do they know this is happening? Do they care at least? Is it a part of their globalization agenda? 

 [10:44:06 a.m.] Rob: and quite frankly, I live in a secular country, church and state were separated a very long time ago, so please don't use any religious doctrine to try and steer politicial life for me here

[10:53:50 a.m.] Rob: Islam is one of the growing religions in the world
[10:54:30 a.m.] Rob: and one that is presently immigrating everywhere
[10:57:13 a.m.] Rob: however if it is going to survive it will have to do one of two things, either Muslims will have to moderate their opinions or there is going to be civil war
[10:57:50 a.m.] Rob: I'll be back in a few minutes have to go get my clothes from the dryers downstairs

                   And then... our discussion was put on hold due to the dryer machine and clean underwear. Though Robert takes an interesting realistic and very common position when asked about the Muslims, he, as most people do, tends to respect the Muslims but wants them to do their worshiping as quitely as they can. Not interrupting his day life and do not coming to his neighborhood trying to change, with hostility, the religious map of the world.

 oppressed+muslim+womenMuslims are known for being passionate for their beliefs and Religion. Their way of thinking is in most ways, extreme, and that is why the world fear them so much. But, if they are this minority we all believe they are. Why do they look like so many and why are they so absolutely convinced the world is going to be theirs?What is the secret they know? Should we really be worried?

[11:45:14 a.m.] Rob: regardless of what the world would like to think about Muslims in general, they are neither better nor worse than any religious fanatics, be they Christian, Jew, Hindu, etc.
[11:45:47 a.m.] Rob: They just happen to be the most vocal right now
[11:45:57 a.m.] Mauricio Betancourt: Hum
[11:46:00 a.m.] Mauricio Betancourt: That is right
[11:46:06 a.m.] Rob: They're the "teenagers" of the religious world right now
[11:46:07 a.m.] Mauricio Betancourt: Interesting point
[11:46:14 a.m.] Rob: and we all know what teenagers can be like

And I decided to remember the history books and retrospectivly look at our past. I found Christianity and Catholicism. They too were young doctrins thousands and hundreds of years ago. The naughty teenagers who took advantage of the toddlers religions those days.  The teenagers all feared. The ones who murdered millions. The ones who had to murder millions to become the most powerful doctrins in the face of the earth if not the most powerful of all.

20100616_AfghanburkasTherefore, is this the beginning of the Muslim integration? Are we really granting them the power they claim so desperately?

I had a dream a few years ago. And I saw a person covered from head to feet with a black sheet. I thought then that was a weird black ghost. Now I know it was about Islam. Then, in that dream I was seated in my office writing and saw a huge bright light coming towards me. I got scared. I was mute and frozen. I closed my eyes when the light got me and then nothing.... nothing... I opened my eyes and saw nothing but naked burned soil. There was nothing else there. Nothing.

By Mauricio Betancourt

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I am not so sure about the world domination thing, because Christianity had tried that for many years. I think the problem is fanaticism, not faith. R
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing it.
Wow.. this was well done my friend.
In Quebec's provincial offices Muslim women must show their face or they will not be served.
I was shocked. It just seems to ricochet.
Rated with hugs
Thank you Jon for being the first one! :)
@Libmomrn: You are probably right... Fanaticism might be the issue here but, I think, fanatics come from very deep believes and those believes, no matter what their sort is, make them passionate and totally world blind. Religious and fanaticism make their faith. They don´t believe in anything else.
@Duane: Thanks for stoping by.
@Linda: Thank you again my dear Linda. Something that happens here in Colombia is that where ever you see a Muslim people don´t come closer. Hum... that must have to do with us used to bombs blowing buildings and all that shit....
Thanks for reading it. Love you
I think it is not very practical to look at Muslims as a single group. Do you think that Mormons, Catholics, and Pentecostals are the same because they are all Christians?
Interesting piece, Mauro. "Muslims are known for being passionate for their believes and Religion." One can replace "Muslims" with any religion of the world in that statement. The issue is not religion, it is the fanaticism and the ignorance that drive people to commit absurdities.
Interesting and I liked the dialog portion.
Dreams huh interesting point... Or opinion. Nice post.
You've got Muslims in Colombia? Eek, they're everywhere.
Interesting post, I'm going to look at some of the resources you've included.
Best Wishes,
What does the Christian God say about this? Why does He allow it?

The old dilemma: either God's acts are necessary and therefore not free...or they are free and therefore arbitrary...has been sufficient to impale the vast majority of Christian philosophers down the ages.
-Keith Ward

Thus you are impaled, sir.
Maricio ... Good stuff! Well written! And you raise some interesting, even profound, questions ... so much so that I am responding on my own post ... referencing yours. Hope you don't mind. Your contributions to OS are much appreciated by me. {{{R}}}
@Rod: of course I don´t mind... please let me know when yours is finished
The cause of religious tolerance, which we are told was bedrock dogma in Islam, is nothing of the sort.

There are two problems with Islam. One problem is that their Holy Book, the Qu'ran, was compiled by third parties long after Mohammad's death (peace and blessings upon him), and remains incomplete because there are more than 1 million hadiths (traditional sayings ascribed to the Prophet, as reported by his close cohorts during his life) but no agreement upon which are legitimate.

(The citation as to the number of hadiths appeared in Wikipedia prior to 2010, but the actual number of hadiths now appears to have been redacted from the entries on this subject.)

Most Muslim scholars believe that between 10,000 and 100,000 of those one million hadiths are legitimate. The actually number is probably closer to 5,000 since there are innumerable repetitions of the same story told by different reporters. Some Muslim scholars have put forth the belief that NONE of the hadiths are authentic.

Unfortunately, no matter which estimate you accept, no two scholars list the same hadiths among the legitimate, hence there is no general agreement as to which hadiths are legitimate, and therefore, Islam is whatever your imam says it is....because any imam can find a hadith to support virtually any point of view.

Consider this: the conflict between Sunni and Shi'ia schools of Islam derive exclusively from their differing hadiths. Both schools have the Qu'ran in common.

If this doesn't terrify you, you aren't paying attention.

The only options open to Muslims is to accept one version or another of a vague truth....or embrace rationalism.

The rationalist element within Islam has a name. It's name is Sufism (well, that's actually a German word, but tasswaofff doesn't have any meaning to Westerners so Sufism will have to suffice.)

The original sufis were dissenters, many of them atheists, others who advanced rationalistic doctrines about the divinity that modern physicists find presage their own works.

However, the term itself has been hijacked by mullas and imams who call themselves Sufis while expressing an ultra-orthodox Islam that has nothing whatsoever to do with Sufism itself.

How is this important?

It renders discussions about "Islam" moot to the same extent that discussing the Hindu religion is pointless because, just as there are many Hindu sects, there are nearly as many Islamic sects, far more than the three that most people know about.

The problem with Islam is that there's no middle ground.

You cannot be a liberal Muslim because an observant Muslim must obey all those instructive hadiths that control life in Islam. One example: there's no mention of the hijab, burqa or other forms of female attire. All the Qu'ran says is that observant women should dress modestly....but there's no clear definition of what the means in the Qu'ran itself.

The term hajb - "veil" - appears half a dozen times, but never in conjunction with woman's clothing. In one case, it refers to a screen placed between Mary, mother of Jesus, and a visiting angel. There are five references in which the word burqa, none of which refer to female clothing.

So, then, it seems, the whole hue and cry about the attire of Muslim women, which is creating divisive feelings around the world, is based upon different readings of possibly specious hadiths.
@Sage: Thank you for taking the time and give me a very good lesson on this subject. But what you are saying makes me more afraid of them. Is like imagining millions of bulls running towards one totally blindfold and scared of their own confusion. All I know is that they are extreme in every aspect of their lifes. They take everything by the book and THE ARCHITECT SAVE US... their book IS ALL MESSED UP.
PD: Is good to see you around....