Stories From A Life

Been there. Done that. Writing about it.

Sally Swift

Sally Swift
Location
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA
Birthday
June 14
Title
VP, Repartee
Company
Swift Retorts
Bio
sally: a journey, a venture, an expression of feeling, an outburst, a quip, a wisecrack ... me

Editor’s Pick
JUNE 11, 2010 11:39AM

Immigration, Englitch, Cheese Steaks and Baseball

Rate: 33 Flag

genos

"If you can't tell me what you want, I can't serve you. It's up to you. If you can't read, if you can't say the word cheese, how can I communicate with you - and why should I have to bend? I got a business to run." Joey Vento, owner, Geno's Steaks

If you think "We know them when we see them' is bad, you've never been to Philly. The debate reached new heights a few years ago and is still raging. Sometimes quietly, sometimes not.

No, we haven't passed bigoted and probably illegal hate legislation. Here, it's more about business than politics. And one man's courageous --or outrageous, you decide-- stand.

First, no matter what Tea Baggers or Arizona say, America is a country of immigrants. Few places have known that fact better or longer than New York, Boston and Philadelphia. Few places have treated immigrants better, or worse, than those cities.

America is also a country of individualists. Eccentrics. Characters. Some you love. Some you love to hate. Many of our locally grown here have come out of South Philly.

South Philly was, and still is, primarily an Italian neighborhood. Paison central. Close knit, territorial, more than a little inbred, enormously proud of its Italian heritage. Mobbed up? Sure. Politically connected? you bet.

If you're running for any office in the land, you better eat at Pat's or Geno's.

Ahem... wonder if she asked for moose meat?

sp

And over at Pat's... (See, this is why I'm a Pat's girl).

jb

Does South Philly have borders? Only other Philadelphia neighborhoods.

Immigrants still flock to South Philly, many from Itality but a growing number from Asian and especially Hispanic countries. The streets are bustling and lively, housing cheap and plentiful, people, for the most part, mind their own business. And frankly, with so many Italian restaurants per square foot, lots of busboys, dishwashers and janitors are needed.


gt
From a Geno's t-shirt. 

American Englitch, South Philly Style
Sout Philly is solid, flag-flying  American to the core. But it has a language all it's own. Philadelphia is pronounced Fluffya. You don't say "hey," you say "YO!" There's the ever popular youse, Philly-speak for "y'all".

ss

If you're thirsty, get a drink of wooder. If it's cold in the house, close the windez. And by the way, what schtreet do you live on?

Make no mistake though, even if it sounds strange to the rest of the country, Sout Fluffyans speak Englitch and are proud of it.

If you've seen the movie "Rocky" or the more recent "Invincible" you got a realistic slice of South Philly life.

Speaking of slice, South Philly is also all about Italian food.

Sure, Philadelphia has world class restaurants of every possible ethnic and epicurean style. Celebs flock to them. But they go more often to "the corner."

 Which wife is that?

 lk

Where they can get our world famous People Food. Soft pretzels. Pizza. Tasty Kakes. Hoagies. And most of all, best of the best, cheese steaks. All courtesy of South Philly. Loved by top chefs everywhere.

 

Geno's                                                              Pat's

msrr

 Neither apparently not very fattening... HA!

rs

Cheese Wit?
Philly folks, whether they live in South Philly or on the posh Main Line are typically loyalists when it comes to Sout' Philly's two top diagonally placed cheesesteak stands, Pat's and Geno's.

You're either a Pat's person or a Geno's person. As I said, I'm a Pat's girl, through and through. My son is a Geno's guy. My husband's that rare breed who just gets in the shortest line.

There you go, two more things that make America great. Freedom of Choice. Opportunity. There's another on display at that corner these days: Freedom of Expression.
 

~~~~~THE SIGN~~~~~

g sign

Maybe you heard about the Philly brouhaha over a sign (see photo above) --This is AMERICA ... WHEN ORDERING SPEAK ENGLISH -- put up by Geno's colorful owner, Joey Vento.

Joey V was born in South Philly. His parents were Italian immigrants and had trouble learning English. But at least they tried. And managed to get by. Joey thinks every immigrant should try too.

I can't say I disagree. Whenever we travel to foreign countries we try to learn a few critical phrases. "Where's the bathroom?" "Can you help me?" "Excuse me." Most people in those countries have been responsive and kind, applauding and encouraging our efforts.

Even in Englitch, you still have to know how to order.

sign

Even more to Joey V's point, I've lived in foreign countries and made sure I learned enough to get around. So if I can order 'Pepsi con ghiaccio' in Rome or "pommes frites" in Paris, an Hispanic immigrant living in South Philly can learn to say "cheese wit" if he wants a steak sandwich with onions and cheese Whiz at Geno's. (Don't gag. Trust me, it's heaven).

cs

Philadelphia's Commission on Human Relations filed a discrimination complaint against Geno's for that sign. They lost. Obviously they needed Oprah on their side. Fail.

o

As far as I know, Geno's hasn't turned anybody away. Joey Vento is simply expressing a widespread and growing frustration with immigrants --especially illegal ones-- who can't or won't learn English.

I think Joey's sign is over the top. But the sentiment resonates with anyone who lives anywhere in America among a large foreign-born, foreign-speaking population.

It isn't rocket science, it's common sense: if you move to America and plan to live your life here, you should learn to speak English. Period. Still, we all should give you a chance --and some help-- to learn. Whoever you are.

ba

Baseball Signs
During baseball season in 2006 Son and I went to "the corner" for some cheesesteaks.The triangle was packed with people and cars. Okay, the sign had just become national news, but it was 4 PM on a Thursday afternoon. WTF?

Then we caught on. New York and New Jersey license plates. Mets shirts. Phillies shirts. The game was over and the crowds wanted to eat and debate.

"It's a disgrace," one man said to my son after asking, "Which is the place with the sign?" then heading for Geno's much longer line, camera in hand.

"Yo, youse seen da sign? Dem people should learn howta speak Englitch," came, ironically, from another fine Philly American.

I'm beginning to think phone menus in Philadelphia should offer three options.

For English, press one.
For Spanish, press two.
For Sout' Philly Englitch, press tree.

tl

One final note. I took a couple of quizzes on the subject.

What Kind of American English Do You Speak?
Your Linguistic Profile:
40% General American English
35% Yankee
15% Dixie
5% Upper Midwestern
0% Midwestern

What, no Sout Fluffya?

Here's the jackpot quiz:  How American Are You?

The very first question is about guns. Yep, it's an American quiz for sure.

You Are 60% American
Most times you are proud to be an American. Though  sometimes the good ole US of A makes you cringe. Still, you know there's no place better suited to be your home. You love your freedom and no one's going to take it away from you!

I wonder how Joey Vento would score. (Tell us how you do).

Speaking of scores... excuse me while I go watch a Phillies game. And cheer some "hometown" players named Ibanez, Polanco, Castro, Ruiz, Bastardo and Contreras.

You probably do that for your team too. So do Diamondbacks fans. Where would baseball be without its valuable foreign-born players, many Hispanic?

There you go, our National Pastime, All-American style.

phillies

Final Note: No matter the many personal and political theories about immigration and speaking English, when it comes to the Phillies, any language will do.

ph

 

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Maybe if the Flyers had eaten more cheese steaks and less Canadian bacon. JUST KIDDING! Go Phillies!
Oh, Sally! I am laughing so hard that I am crying! Going into South Philly is like entering another planet. I agree that I would like to see immigrants learn English, if only to avoid being discriminated against. However, Sout Fluffa is hard to learn! R
Sally, I took my grandsons to Sesame Place a couple of weeks ago and you know I had to have a cheesesteak! I was on my way to Chicago and my 5 year old grandson didn't want any of that "nasty looking thing". Somewhere on the turnpike he decided to give it a try and wouldn't you know...I had to get cheesesteaks coming and going.
Now I'm hungry!
Only 45%? I'm an American not some outsider.
I want a cheese steak! What a wonderful and informative post. Thanks for sharing this.
I grew up in the Philly(are we allowed to say that) area.
There is no better cheese steak in the entire world.

I hung around with several co-workers from South Philly. I even got to meet some Mafia families. Nice but kind of scary.
Everyone seems to be commenting on the cheese steaks and avoiding the bigger issue. As the daughter of immigrants who arrived after WWI, I understand the frustration with people who refuse to learn our language. Like you, when I travel, I make an attempt to learn as much of the native language of the country I am visiting to make communication easier. That's the respectful thing to do. I was born in an area of New Jersey that is now heavily Spanish populated. It is discouraging to enter a store owed by non-English speaking people and be refused service because they do not understand me. Everyone should be welcomed in this country with the caveat that we all are or want to be Americans.
R
You may be the best writer I've come across on OS so far. Your last two posts were killer; I'd happily read them in national publications.

By the way, because I'm a nut for phonetics, I'd have ended that Hebrew with a zion instead of a samech, unless you want to say it with a Dutch accent.
WTF hoagies. They're grinders. DUH!

As per speaking English: I kind of agree, which is why I (as I'm sure you do) support every program for ESL and bilingual teachers to help kids in public schools. There are lots of volunteer oppurtunities to learn the basics of ESL and tutor adults here. I have tried to work the training into my schedule.
I also regret not keeping up with my Spanish - being bilingual (or tri or more!) seems to me to be the peak of knowledge.
This is next-to-perfect, and I say this as a Philly Guy born/raised. R.
Eh, youse nailed it, Sally.

I've been to Philly exactly once, in an ill fated attempt to bring a classic BMW home. The car thing didn't work out but I spent a memorable day running around town with a local.

What amazed this westerner most was how obviously old the city is. My local guide had no idea what I meant by that.

Anyways, you really captured the city and the whole immigration issue in the process, but no cheese whiz, okay?
Libmom, you're exactly right Sout Flufflya is another planet. With the best food in the Universe. I stand by my stand that if you move to another country you should try to learn the language. But you haven't lived til you've heard Flufflyan spoken with a foreign accent. Seriously.

Fay, cheesesteaks at Sesame Place? Well, okay, better than none at all. Next time you're in the area, call me and I'll take you to Pat's.

Bob, the test doesn't lie. Can I see your passport? heh

Dave, come and get one! Do not accept imitations from other cities.

Bonnie, you too. You're always in. :)

Blackflon, you will appreciate my story about Philly politics, South Philly style... How I Almost Got Arrested on Election Day

Donna, you and I are on the same page. I'm betting all commenters are, so far. We'll see if there's any reaction to Joey's sign here.

koshersal, thank you!! If you look in the background of that sign you'll see a silvery structure... it's a synagogue famously designed by Frank Lloyd Wright. Reform, what do they know about correct Hebrew spelling? ;)

aim, HOAGIES. No matter what they're called elsewhere, they were invented right here in Philly. Jeez, do I have to tell that story too? heh We do agree on ESL, there should be more classes.

Jonathan, ahem, "next-to-perfect" ??? Get outta heah.
Gak! I'm only 37%. Your post is full of good humor, which is something I like posts wit.
Cap'n, I'd have bet the farm you'd be a 'whiz' guy. heh Glad you enjoyed our great city.

Stacey, as we say here, tanks much.

NOTICE: Not rating could make me send Richard Simmons to your house to sweat you around. Just sayin...
You can call Joey Vento "colorful", but I still prefer the truth = "bigot".

I'm 100% Sicilian. Both sets of my grandparents came over on the boat from Nicosia. Only one member of each family learned English (like MOST of the immigrants of their time). The rest didn't because they spent the majority of their lives speaking their native language in their Chicago neighborhood (Bridgeport).

ESPECIALLY, considering how they were treated and how they lived (i.e. CHOSE to not learn English), I've always been constantly amazed at how bigoted Italians (and especially Sicilians are) towards other minority groups. They seem to take a tremendous amount of pride in who can be the most outrageously stupid about it.

As a person who was a long time California resident, I can guarantee you (and the "Joey's of the world) that the percentage of undocumented aliens in the U.S. work much harder to learn English than Joey's or my ancestors did (and I'm not sure I'd buy the claim that Joey really speaks English himself = "youse" is NOT a word!). So that little saying about "glass houses" keeps popping into my mind...

To paraphrase the words of another person who's post I read this morning on another site ( http://www.ourbiggayborhood.com/2010/06/concerned-women-for-american-prejudges-study-about-lesbian-parenting/comment-page-1/#comment-2381 ):

"Joey" (freak'in, pu-lease) is entitled to this own opinions. However, he's not entitled to his own facts or history. In the interest of logic, reality, and integrity, it’s time for him, and those whose prejudices are fed by the likes of him, to learn that distinction.

(with total respect to the brilliant Fannie from whom I copp'ed the gist of her brilliant words. (http://fanniesroom.blogspot.com/ ) )
I'm a connoisseur of local and regional accents. This was so fun to read - thank you!
This dances on a very similar line, although far less controversially, as Rand Paul's around private property. This guy is essentially telling you conditions for service lest he opt not to serve you.

In very generic terms it's a concept we can get our heads around.

And then there are the egregious examples we do not like, which means our principals/theories bang up against horrific examples we do not want to condone or support.

Telling someone to order in english seems far more tolerable than "get out of here, you're [black/brown/Yellow/gay/fat/male/female/ugly/whatever]."
Very enjoyable! Makes me want to visit Fluffya, a city I've never been to before (just drove by it on the Jersey side of the river years ago).

However, you'll never convince me to put cheese whiz on an otherwise perfectly good sandwich!
He may have the right to the sign, but to post such a thing just makes him appear to be a giant douche. If I make it to Philly, I will definitely be going to Pat's.
Oops, Sal. Beth Shalom, designed by Frank Lloyd Wright, is conservative, not reform. So watch it!
Safe_Bet, you make reasonable points and which such passion, you should write a post of your own. I don't know if Joey Vento is a bigot. He never refused service to anyone. His hiring practices and community service efforts are what stopped the Human Rights Commission. He merely spoke his mind. This is America, he can do that too. I said I didn't like it, but I agreed with the sentiment. That's my right as well.

j lynne, glad you enjoyed.

Gwool, good points and my reply is what I just said to Safe_Bet. Although your argument, as a card-carrying WASP, was more, shall we say, detached.

Steve, with your love of history you've never been to Phila?? Get yourself here, man, we're the Birthplace of America. And I bet I can get you to eat your cheesesteak with whiz.

maatkare, Pat's is better anyway. Plus, I'll take you to Jim's which is in a category by itself with zero controversy.

Judy, details, details. I didn't name the synagogue but the cat's out now. They call themselves Conservative but are more like KI. (Big sisters just won't let you get away with anything, jeez).
I never ate Philly cheesesteaks--until I left. Great post.
Let's hear it for my hometown: Chicago Blackhawks beat Philly Flyers!
Rocky's dialect was more North Jersey/New York than South Philly.
Rocky's dialect was more North Jersey/New York than South Philly.
Sally, you've flooded me with nostalgia, so much so that we might just come up there and impose again.

How are you and the other half?

I've been a Pat's person ever since, in the 50's, we'd sneak out of lunch hour at South Catholic High School at 9th & Christian, run to Pats, eat the cheesesteak on our way back.

Pat's steaks are so great, and have always been, because the grill is stacked with eons of grease. Talk about seasoning a pan or grill, this is the ultimate seasoned surface. (I'm sure it's been replaced a number of times).

The reach of Pat's is great. When Donna and I went to pick out silver for our wedding back in 1981 at Geary's, the woman who helped us was Pat's former wife.

The year before I met Donna I was at the Improv, hitting on a lovely blonde lady, told her I was from Philly, talked about Pat's steaks and she said, "I'm Pat's daughter."

Pat's forever.
I went to Geno's when I was on a pro wrestling tour in 2001. I was with another wrestler from Tijuana but he spoke perfect English so they still served the guy. We both put their hottest hotsauce on our cheese steaks thinking that it would be really weak compared to what we were used to being from California and Mexico respectively. Man we were dying. It was the hottest salsa either of us have ever had. Sweat was just gushing out of our pores but we still finished those damned cheesesteaks. We weren't going to let some damned Pennsylvania hot sauce beat us. Geno's has a lot of autographed pics of pro wrestlers on its walls. Don't they have a signed pic of the Iron Sheik? I forget.
sixtycandles wrote: "Let's hear it for my hometown: Chicago Blackhawks beat Philly Flyers!


I wasn't going to go there, seeing as how sixtycandles started,

My Sicilian bigots (and relatives) deep dish pizza and Blackhawks can kick your Italian bigots punk ass Cheese Steak and Flyers ass any day of the week!
"Fluffya"
Loved it - great post - great message.
I grew up in "da Bronx"..so, I kind of understand.
I'm eating a grinder right now.
I often rate later to help bump the feed. Please don't send the Pinkertons. Now I cannot unburn the image of Richard Simmons sweatin' me. (Sometimes, I'll even rate again and the number goes down by one. Then I rate again and it goes back up. Same total - only - it shows up on the activity feed anew. Who knew?)

I'm practicing "the stance." (Congrats on the EP and "top of the fold.")
I had a boyfriend break up with me in Philadelphia. I also had the best cheesesteak ever. In life, everything evens out._r
Great post. I love Philly, oh, and the cheese steaks too. I get his beef with the language too. I want people to at least try and speak English. It is our language here. I don't like the idea of having Spanish on everything....could it be an enabler? R
sixty and Safe_Bet, do youse really wanna mess wit me and my Floyers? Jeez, Emily already got in my face about dem damn Yankees! For da record, we gave allayas a run for it.

gooners, YO! Rocky was pure Sout Philly. Which also sounds like Sout Jersey, as opposed to North Joisey.

Sarah, a Philly cheesesteak only counts if you eat it in Philly. Or, okay, "down the shore."

JohnnyBoni, how da hell are ya? Great story about Pat's daughter! I took Donna and Sasha to JIM's (my real personal fave) and they loved it. Get your tushies up here already.

Karen, for a Canadian you are remarkably well versed in Fluffya speak. I'd love to get together wit chew.

Bob, great story. Geno's gets their killer hot sauce from their Hispanic friends and employees. AHEM. You can look for pics of wrestlers here

trilogy, "da Bronx" qualifies you absolutely to unnerstand Fluffya.

aim, now I have to tell the HOAGIE story.

Stacey, thank you.

Joan, as the wise guys say in Philly, "Leave the boyfriend. Take the cheesesteak."
Sheila, we crossed but we're SO on the same page.

Btw, Karen, you go girl!!
Go Iggles!!

The sign is proper, and since he went through so much crap and stood his ground I only eat there.

I was stationed in Italy for 2 years, the better my Italian got the less and less everything cost. Everyone expects you to learn the language of the country you live in. It's the illegals, and a bunch of lazy people that make a fuss.
Once ya eat in Philly, you don't like notin' else. I found that out from eating in Iowa. When they say spicy out here, they mean too much black peper. And when they say pizza, they mean American on toasted bread.

It's funny but the gormet here don't match the regular there. Cheese stakes, hoagies, tripe sandwhiches and real bar-b-que. Where else?
sixty and Safe_Bet, do youse really wanna mess wit me and my Floyers? Jeez, Emily already got in my face about dem damn Yankees! For da record, we gave allayas a run for it.


So we talk'in vendetta here? Just remember that I AM Sicilian and that Joseph "Uncle Joe" Ligambi really is my Uncle Joe!
I'm a fat truck driver, who spent 20 years in the restaurant business, who loves cheesesteaks. I've eaten them all over the country. I have to say that the best is from a place in Jersey where I go.

I've always wanted to go to Geno's. So the next time I'm in town, who is going to give me a ride? I don't think the city would like it if I parked this thing in the street just to get a cheesesteak to go.

BTW, I'm buying.
What about Koch's? My son ate there several times a week when he went to Penn. And he gets cheese steaks delivered from some famous place to Manhattan for his birthday every year. Philly gets in the blood, or maybe the stomach in his case.
Two Thumbs, you got it right. Americans go abroad and expect everybody to speak English but we don't require it here at home. If we did, maybe better treatment, better jobs. When we speak the language in another country we get those perks.

mary gravitt, I remember hearing about Velveeta and ketchup on an English muffin being called pizza. Yikes!

Safe_Bet, so what do I gotta do to make nice wit chew? Hmm. Buddy's dead, Vince is in jail, my protection's not what it was onst. Dint you like my story about da paisans in Sout Philly? How I Almost Got Arrested on Election Day

Cat, you can park in front of my house, I'll take you to Geno's. It's in da neighborhood.
Lea, we crossed while I was deleting spam. Koch's Deli? Great food, never thought of it for cheese steaks. Clearly I went to Penn a LOT earlier than your son. He probably orders from Philly Food, aka A Taste of Philly.
There is some womp ass mega cheese piled high pride in this here post! What a fun ride you just took us on and the photos are wonderful, especially the first one! Sally, this is a work of art, love for your city and more so, your love of an all American way of life. This post reaks so good of good old fashioned American pride. We need big doses of this every day!
Cathy, thank you so much. I got support on my Israel post but then the bashing started, plus Karen's back in the hospital getting more transfusions. It helped a lot to focus on Mom and Apple Pie and a Philly cheesesteak 'wit'.
Wow, all this PA love on the cover today. Amish and Philly--very cool.

I really enjoyed this essay--fun and informative.

But Gino can go fu----
Well, let's just say he wouldn't be welcome in my home. Tit for tat.

Thanks for the cool essay Sally!
Love cheese steak...and your posting!! : )

rated
I don't really have a problem with signage. But I now have a probelm with a craving for a real S. Philly cheesesteak. I never order one when I'm out because once you've had the real thing, there are NO substitutes. Certainly none that are worth risking that level of calories and saturated fat!
Cheese steak is a new concept for me. I'm not sure if I would like it ... the pic with cheese whiz or whatever it was in the saucepan didn't exactly grab me!

But a very educational post - especially for a non-American! Thank you Sally.
What about tourists? Particularly those that can't handle the South Philly accent? I remember being in college and, despite being from the Northeast, not understanding one word in two spoken by some of the people from around Philadelphia. I got a student job in the cafeteria and was unable to communicate with the local help.
Apparently I'm only 5-% american.

and as for your poll, where is Ebonglish?

I am tri lingual: english, ebonics, french. Although now having live din the south for a period I am picking up Dixie. I lived in Phiily for while and when to University in PA with lots of friends from Philly. It IS a different tongue. (you NAILED it with 'Press TREE' !!! I had to LOL at that).
50% fifty! fercrissake.

oops.

I also think people ought to learn a few phrases in their new country. Its the right thing to do.

The most valuable words in another language you can ever learn are "How do you say....". Them you learn to pantomime. If you don't speak english and you know you're going to want a cheesesteak, grab a english/spanish dictionary or look it up online, fercrissake. THIS is how language is learned. Not in the classroom, but in practical day to day life while trying to get your needs met, whatever they might be. The classroom is for us schmucks who don't have the luxury to live and work in a country and learn a language through total immersion. Here they are, immersed, what better way is there to learn English? Learn the word for cheesesteak and please and thank you, then go order it. What?
MJ, glad you liked it. And part of my point here is you can think, and say, whatever you want about Geno! Hello America.

JD, glad you enjoyed too.

Kellylark, you're right, accept no stinkin substitutions!

Little Kate, trust me when I tell you no matter what it looks like, it tastes divine.

Malusinka, wha', you done spik Englitch? Jeez. heh

MaddieP, I LOVE Ebonglish. Glad you enjoyed and obviously we agree everybody should learn a *little* bit of the language wherever they are, especially though emersion. You just forgot one phrase critical to learn: "Where is the bathroom?"
Sally, believe it or not, I know Philly quite well. I got hooked on Hoagies and soft salted pretzels, with lots of mustard of course, while taking one of my many trips to Philadelphia. I once went to the Spectrum to watch a '76er game when Dr. J and McGinnis were playing together. Great thrill. I find it amusing as hell when South Philly folks, and those with thick Southern accents complain about people speaking English. Cracks me up. I will probably never return to the East Coast in this life again. I did enjoy it. This was a fun post. Yo!
Damn, Spud, I wish I'd known you when you were here. Dr J, those were the days.
I speak Yankee, and I have to say "soda"?, "pop"?, puh-leze - it's "tonic". And it's only "Coke" if it's made by a certain Atlanta company. Make mine a Moxie, if you would be so kind. Oh, and St. Who? March 17th is Evacuation Day.

All this regional weirdness is really great and it's one of our strengths. Plus, I don't care what language you order it in, we'll figure it out somehow.
I just got Philly educated. Thank you Sally (and Happy Birthday!).
I took the quizzes and it seems I sound more American than I am.

You Speak Dixie!
50% Dixie
50% General American English
You Are 47% American