Orbital Matters

Saturn Smith

Saturn Smith

Saturn Smith
Birthday
April 06
Title
Ms.
Company
The Solar System
Bio
Everything posted here, and more random thoughts, are also posted at my web site: http://kepkanation.com.

Editor’s Pick
SEPTEMBER 11, 2008 9:50PM

The Interview: Pretty Sorry, Charlie.

Rate: 15 Flag

 So, you're Charlie Gibson, and you land the first interview with Sarah Palin, would-be Vice President, a woman wreathed both in controversy and silence.  You fly to Alaska to talk with her, which means not only have you had at least 10 days to be dreaming up a list of questions, you've also had a long flight on which to think, hooray, hooray, I'm the guy who landed the big interview, oh, what ratings shall we reap!

It's too bad that, apparently, Mr. Gibson had almost no other thoughts on that long flight.

The questions, so far, are bland, and the answers are worse.  Maybe I was predisposed to think this interview was too soft, but I find myself deeply disappointed by the proof that a network anchor whose show is regularly in second place in ratings and who has been in the business for many, many years is conducting a less interesting, less relevant interview than what I'd see if Sarah Palin went on "The Daily Show."

Gibson, of course, tried a little to look like more than a cardboard cut-out of a journalist. He brought up that controversial speech at Palin's church... and then let her use his show to clear the air, to dismiss the whole thing out of hand.  Bravo, Charlie.  There's cunning journalism.

Earlier, he'd tried to show a bit of backbone, too, claiming to be caught in a "blizzard of words" at one point and then continuing to press Palin for an answer on whether she believes the U.S. has the right to invade and attack Waziristan without Pakistani permission -- but when she finally did answer, her answer was that we have the right to do anything and to keep "all options" open when it comes to defeating terrorism.  (The next question, by the way, should have been, "So... a nuclear bomb?")

Then, of course, there was the frightening exchange where Palin had no idea what the Bush Doctrine is, and Gibson politely let that slip through.  Yes, yes, he gave a slightly pedantic definition after she flubbed it, but he didn't point out that she missed it -- nor did he explain the significance of the Bush doctrine.  That's fine and well for those of us who study and dispise it, but not so hot for the average viewer of "World News," who probably thought she was right and he was dorky.  A single line pointing out that the Bush doctrine reversed centuries of American foreign policy would have been a great addition, and would have neatly shown Palin and McCain, and Bush and Cheney, to be out of line -- right or wrong -- with the great swell of American history.

Alas, such critical thinking and reponse was not to be in this polite, scripted match up.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun; maybe more substance is about to follow.  There are still four segments of this interview to nowhere to go, as apparently Mr. Gibson's staff did a lot of thinking about how best to capitalize on his coup during that long flight.  Pieces will be shown on "Nightline" this evening and on tomorrow's "Good Morning America" and "20/20," in addition to being displayed on ABCNews.com.  I think, though, that ABC would have already promoted anything newsworthy -- their fear-mongering headline today about how Palin wants to attack Russia shows that they're betting with an empty hand. 

The only good that can come of this interview, I think, is if Sarah Palin -- and John McCain's campaign -- see her coming off so nicely with Charlie Gibson that they decide she's really ready for prime time.  Perhaps somewhere out there, someone's really ready to ask some meaningful questions.  Is Jon Stewart busy?

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Hi Saturn, I would disagree, and in fact have almost simulataneously posted on my blog exactly the opposite of what you've said here.

I consider that McCain's people picked the journalist for exactly the reason you say he failed. I don't think he let her come off "nicely" at all. He was polite, but persistent. I wonder what you'd have had him ask?
Kelly, I think I was more disappointed in Gibson's follow-ups, or lack-thereofs, than in the questions altogether. For instance, I'm not sure the root of the original question he asked about experience was ever actually answered -- she ended up talking about her experience with the oil pipelines, and he didn't go back enough to get a real answer. He also didn't follow up well when she said that right now people want someone without experience: "Charlie, again, we've got to remember what the desire is in this nation at this time. It is for no more politics as usual and somebody's big, fat resume maybe that shows decades and decades in that Washington establishment, where, yes, they've had opportunities to meet heads of state ... these last couple of weeks ... it has been overwhelming to me that confirmation of the message that Americans are getting sick and tired of that self-dealing and kind of that closed door, good old boy network that has been the Washington elite."
That seems like a quintessential question in the campaign right now, when she's just described her running mate, not her opponent.
I just read your good post on the interview, and I agree that the tone was overall pretty even, but I don't think she was revealed to lack opinions, except among those of us who parse words for a living. I think in general, Gibson let the interview play out in a manner that made things generally look scripted and benign, when what she was actually saying was shocking and troubling.
Thanks. My hunch is that there won't be the type of questions that really get at anything. However, we can always hope for the kind of gaffe that the media considers important. It is a shame that it has come to that, but my fingers are taped together crossed.
Chris Matthews said she said the same rote answer 4 times. She sounded scripted and trained to say a certain thing. Honestly, from what I saw, she seemed to have the vocabulary of an 8th grader.
Saturn, I have plugged your post on mine and if I'd known how to link i would :-)

I thought he let the "Are you experienced enough" answer stand on it's own because he knew he was going on to questions that would demonstrate the BS in there.

As to the "head os state" question, how many people heard the blather after she said "No" to the question of whether she'd ever even met ONE?

But as I say, i was watching to see of Charlie could stand uo strong, and I think he did. I think he showed her llack of experience, and he showed her dodging questions, and he even showed her in a temper she had to fight to reign in.

It could have been better if he'd prodded her to actually lose her temper :-)
Yes, yes, he gave a slightly pedantic definition after she flubbed it, but he didn't point out that she missed it -- nor did he explain the significance of the Bush doctrine.

This is a very good insight, Saturn, one I'd been struggling to identify. What a good journalist should have done, in this case, is not simply ask questions and listen to Palin's answers, but also to add context for viewers who might not have the same background knowledge. In this case it would have been reasonable to point out that the Bush doctrine is important, that a lot of people know about it, and that it's kind of odd for a Vice Presidential candidate not to. Yes, yes, Gibson would have gotten the elitist tag, but one would have to argue that political knowledge in a VP isn't important to make that stick.
I had a completely different take. Even without knowing what the Bush Doctrine is, I think her body language and tap-dancing made it plainly obvious to just about anyone that she didn't know what she was talking about.

You don't have to be a foreign policy genius to see she was way, way out of her depth. I actually regard the clip as a somewhat seminal moment. She looked sad and amateurish, to say nothing of the substance.
As I watch the pundits' "analysis," I can see now that the question is not so much how Gibson made her look, but how much the media is going to forgive her responses.

They are already apologizing for her, even the "neutral" commentators. Predictably, the yardstick they are using to measure her performance is not what a VP nominee should have known, but what Joe Average would know. This is the voting-for-the-beer-buddy disease writ large, and much of the reason why we elect idiots.
I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere with no TV at all. Yes, there aren't even rabbit ear channels -- so I appreciate your summary.

(rated)
Carol and Mary, yeah, the repetitive and the bland seemed to win in this interview. I just can't imagine there's any big "gotcha" moment coming, but... I'll still tune in to see.

Rob, I think a lot of the reason this all seems toned-down is that Gibson is so completely dodging that elitist tag -- and in some ways, maybe that works out better here, because she did manage, as Chris says, to look lost even in front of an empathetic (I won't go so far as to say sympathetic, but... close) interviewer. So it will be harder for the McCain/Palin campaign to argue that she was baited by the elitist media, which is a good move on Gibson's part, but... I still would have liked to see more substantive questioning and pursuit of answers.
Chris (redux) -- yeah, it's depressing, huh?

LT -- thanks! And there's some excerpts up on ABCNews.com, if you want more. I'm not sure I give a very, ah, neutral summary.

And Kelly, thanks for the mention, and I will link your post, now, as... you know, I don't think we're in opposition, so much as focusing in different directions. So... another view? I agree with your point about most people not hearing much of her blather on experience -- that was an interesting moment.
Saturn -

I still think even the most sympathetic or unknowledgable people will come away from some of those clips with an uneasy feeling. I do believe the bloom has come off the rose.
Chris, I have my fingers crossed, I really, really do. (makjkes tyoping harsd, tho)
Saturn, did you see Obama's performance at the forum tonight? That had to inspire confidence. He was at the top of his game. Why? Because they were discussing substance.

Over the next 1-3 weeks, more and more people are going to blink and say, "Wait a second."
This is a great piece. I haven't seen much other than the clips on ABC.
One point, though, that I think is important about this interview is that it will (hopefully) peel away the personality myth about her being both biting and folksy. It was infuriating to read that kind of commentary about her because she was just reading a Rovian script. Taking the script away erodes the initial impression of her as a plain-talking, straight-shooting, slash and burner. The more that we see of her in an unscripted setting, the more, I think, there'll be cracks in her feet of clay.
Chris, I haven't seen it yet, but I'm on my way to find it somewhere online; I could use some Obama good news today!

And Y, yes, I hope this will shatter the personality cult around her a bit, but... we'll see how these others go. The more I think about it, the more I believe that the Good Morning America and 20/20 segments are going to be the really important ones, because of the audiences they reach.
I tend to agree with Chris in DC on this. I think she came off as amateurish. And I'm appalled at the way she chose to dress - - for God's sake, if they win the election she could be President, and she chooses to go bare-legged and short-skirted with long flowing locks? she came across as an earnest PTA mom that could, at any moment, turn abrasive and scary. Firmly of the opinionated because 'my opinion is as good as anyone else's!' ilk vs. appearing knowledgeable, thoughtful, or reflective - much less expert (beyond being expert as a a mom delivering her opinion, that is).

There was nothing statesman-like about her knowledge, delivery, or appearance. of And her answers were far too 'me, myself , my family and I' focused. She did not appear to have a context for any question beyond her life and immediate family.

I was surprised how bad she was. But I'm not surprised the pundit analysis was soft on her. There could still be a story in this if the nice people in TV land still like her, really really LIKE her. And that would be good for ratings - they could then take the angle on how women are bringing a different edge to politics - the ol' iron fist in the velvet glove trope - something that will have the feminists gagging and the misogynists like Limbaugh gleeful.
Sandra, having rewatched it, I certainly see everything you're saying, but as an Obama supporter, I think I was going to see those things anyway. People who loved her going into this interview aren't going to love her any less coming out of it, because she wasn't really pushed into/ led into/ given enough rope to say anything that would change their minds. And people, like me and I think you, who didn't like her going in are going to come out of it liking her as a candidate even less.

And sure, Rush Limbaugh's gonna love it, perhaps because of the bare legs.
I think she did "very well". I don't expect this changed many people's minds. I bet some hedged closer towards now they see her as holding her own. And there were probably some who shifted away. But I think she accomplished all she could in this context.

But, thankfully we get the natural cycles of the news and I expect that there will soon be that predictable swing against her that will take some of the shine off her. I don't think there is anything she could do to avoid that natural rhythm.

I think that unless something really embarrassingly bad happens in this campaign the result is already established. Unfortunately, I don't think we have anyway of figuring that out.

Still, anything could happen tomorrow that would change it big time. My hunch is that as long as each of these four politicians (mostly importantly Obama and McCain, of course) does the kind of thing they normally do (strengths and and weaknesses), we are going to have a fairly close election. I can imagine Obama winning by a slightly surprising amount, but not McCain. If McCain wins I think it will be close. I guess I'm thinking in terms of popular vote, which I know doesn't matter.

night, thanks saturn
For those who didn't find them elsewhere, here are the YouTube links of the Thursday night interviews:

Part one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nuWKHqqLH0

Part two:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imMoUdrRC_A
All things considered, I thought Gibson did a good job. I don't want his analysis or opinion injected into the interview. His job was to lead the conversation and elicit responses to questions that we all have. I think he did that. What we might infer from her answers is totally up to us. Her answers will be spun for the next weeks and those who think she's capable will use the positive spin as proof and those who don't will incorporate the negative in their argument. Before I hear or read much of any spin, I'll just say that I'll give her credit for taking the questions (which she had to do), but wonder what in God's name she was thinking when she didn't blink in her acceptance of this position. I wish she had.
This Palin person is an empty paper bag prepped by McCain's personnel. In the debates, watch for her answering each question with the same old line of chatter. Gibson is not a trained journalist from Columbia or some such recognized school of journalism, he is an actor, an achor man, a rugged face. Do not expect too much from him or his co-horts who are more of the same though they think they are "God's gift". The real problem here is the naivete (I am being kind) of the American people who buy what Palin has to sell hook line and sinker. She speaks of the threat of "Islamic" extremists. How about the Christian extremists that threaten our internal stability?
There's only so much time for a dance like this on national television.

Gibson has to be courteous; he can't just shake Palin like a rag doll, in hopes the answers her opponents want will fall on the floor like marbles.

On the most important question put to her - on the "Bush Doctrine" of preemption - Palin's first answer revealed ignorance, and, interestingly, lack of anticipation and preparation; and then she just stumbled along to a vague answer about necessary self-defense.

Well, of course. Any reasonably sturdy, low level American official would say something like that.

It was mush.

In this series most important series of questions, Gibson laid a glove on her, and was successful.
Personally, I thought the interview was spot on. Gibson couldn't have done it better. If Gibson had badgered Palin that would have provided the GOP with the convenient sexist out, or liberal media bias, you take your pick.

Instead, Gibson let Palin make herself look bad, without any interference. That is what has got to be giving McCain nausea this morning -- Gibson didn't try to rough her up, just laid on some direct questions -- and Palin fell flat on her face.

This is what the public needs right now. Don't humiliate her, simply expose her for what she is. There is no reason to sink her ship if she is in the process of running it into an iceberg.
YOU HAVE BEEN OBAMATIZED.....

Obama for president! I think that is the funniest tag line for a joke I have heard all year.

It is amazing that he still has fans that think he is a great guy... Eventhough he is a documented liar, has questionable relationships, wants to lessen our countries security, and has strong immoral beliefs. You would think that this wouldn't be an issue because of his obvious failings, but it appears that ignorance is at an all time high!

It sure is scary that people have the ability to smile while they contribute to the decline of America.

Get out your "I love China!" bumper stickers.
We need to put on the verbal hockey gear, take to the blog and comment ice, and pound this woman into the boards of truth so hard she has to leave the game. She set herself up for it. Maybe Alex Ovechkin of the Washington Caps can give us a hand on that one, since she and Bomb Bomb seem so willing to renew tensions with his native country, Russia.
Troll James: pass your gas someplace else, please.
Tom, thanks for the links; those will make good reference points, since ABC still hasn't put the whole thing up (unless I'm missing it). Carol, you may be right, things may already be set -- but I want to believe that the debates are still going to matter. Particularly after last night.

Michael and DT -- yeah, I agree that there's something to be said for the conduct of the interview giving the Republicans nothing really to complain about in terms of his treatment of Palin, so it makes their rebuttal harder. But it's already a campaign divorced from reality in its attacks on media, so I'm not sure how much that matters.

I've actually re-read these comments this morning before trekking out in search of further media takes on the interview, so now I'll go see what the rest of the world thinks. It really is the post-interview spin that matters, here, more than the interview itself, which seems very sad.
I'd love to see her on The Daily Show and then on The Colbert Report. Kind of a nice one-two punch. She'd be back as governor before you could say HA.

@james bowen - Interesting - can you support those claims with anything substantial?

Or should we just take your word for it?
No you shouldn't take my word... do a little research and don't be so lazy. There is plenty of information out there.

snipet:
immoral beliefs - he stopped a bill that would assist babies that survived late term abortions. He said it would be an inconvience for a mother. He would rather them suffacate in a utility closet before they through them in the dumpster.

quesitonable relationships-several racists and a couple of known terrorist

lies- a bunch. One specifically would be his statement of cutting taxes for 95% of the people, not true his scale for tax increases are for people that make $45,000 and up. he wants to increase full tax, death tax, general tax, etc...

The China comment stems from is liking of China's government structure and his desire to make the government as big as possible. I hope you a ready to fork over your cash.

That was just a taste. Do your homework.
Wow! If James hadn't shown up, I would have continued being an Obama supporter forever! But, thanks to his incisive arguments and truthiness, I am having serious doubts about Obama now!

"That was just a taste?" Damn, I'd hate to deal with the full course - that would just be too much!
james bowen,

"...he is a documented liar, has questionable relationships, wants to lessen our countries security, and has strong immoral beliefs."

Who are you talking about? Bush? Cheney?
All this comments cracked me up. You guys just are angry & bitter because nobody excepted McCain would pick Sara Palin. I found Gibson very curt. He was like a college profeesor and trying to find a mistake. She did really good. I can't wait to see Biden & Palin debate. I think Biden was the worst veep Obama could pick. King of gaffes will be so big liability for Obama. Still nobody forgot lipstick comment. Obama choose his words very carefully. He did it because he wanted to have Palin's spotlight. Well! Obviously he got backlash. I say we should all wait for debates.
Bored, I agree, the debates will be something to watch... though that seems like all we can agree on.
Oh come on, he badgered her, and made her look like a liar on quiet a few questions. Almost to the point of feeling sorry for her because he was so persistent. It was like a Chris Mathews interview.